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Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query

Posted by DanielSL 
DanielSL
Daniel
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Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
June 29, 2016 01:59PM
What do you guys think of using a Third Gen (81-85), for a Rallycross project?

I've been looking at doing something cheap while building my GTi, and having a RWD to go along with the FWD, so I can run in multiple divisions. I also kind of like doing something that harkens back to the 80's, since that's when I was introduced to Rallying.

The 22-RE engine can be built powerful and bulletproof for cheap, and the W58 transmission is an alloy cased unit with close to close ratio specs supplied as stock. Both have huge availability, and ease of repair, which is nice as well.
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Aaron Luptak
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
June 29, 2016 02:23PM
SCCA Rallycross I assume?

If you're trying to be competitive on a national level, I'd guess (gut instinct and nothing else) that celica will not be particularly good versus the current cream-of-the-crop (Miatas mostly IIRC).

If you're not trying to be competitive on a national level, then:
1. Can you buy it and keep it running cheaply?
2. Will you be excited about the thought of racing it?

If yes to both (or a strong enough yes to #2 to offset the costs on #1), then do it, it's just for shits and giggles anyways.



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Keith Morison
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
June 29, 2016 02:29PM
I'd probably look for a matching car to your GTi. Future spare parts source as well as being a building block for skills and mechanical knowledge as opposed to a completely different knowledge base. Then again, diversity isn't a bad thing.
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DanielSL
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
June 29, 2016 03:11PM
It would only be a shits and giggles car. My wife wants to build a Trans Am, and I am all for it, as it would be something we could do together. But then I was thinking how fun it would be to have a RWD car to mess with myself. Its just thinking right now, nothing serious.

I could do a Celica for about the same price as a Miata, so maybe the Miata would just be the best bet as they are competitive. But I keep wanting something that looks like an "old school" rally car, from the mid 80's.

The GTi's are all FWD, so getting another would just be a waste of money, even though it would mean spares. Then again, I have a 10' x 40' storage unit for spares for all my other projects that never get completed. LOL.
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 02, 2016 01:01PM
i rallied one back in the day great cars




I would rather drive a slow car fast as a fast car slow!
first rule of cars: get what makes you happy, your the one paying for it!
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tdrrally
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 02, 2016 01:02PM
if i were still in the southwest where those cars still exist i would have a few around




I would rather drive a slow car fast as a fast car slow!
first rule of cars: get what makes you happy, your the one paying for it!
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Ascona73
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 02, 2016 04:35PM
Coolest part about a third gen is you can make a pretty good copy of this:



Definitely one of the fastest 2wd rally cars run in Group B.



Opel is a 4-letter word...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10498579@N07/sets/
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 02, 2016 05:13PM
Quote
Ascona73
Coolest part about a third gen is you can make a pretty good copy of this:



Definitely one of the fastest 2wd rally cars run in Group B.

I got to see three of those going --Shekar Mehta, And Lars-Erik Torph and Steve Millen in the last event they would ever run---after I DNFed.. They worked well..Solid and stable and quick...(hours behind the leaders but hey, it was a serious fight for the win..everybody else was to some degree cruising.

Yeah, makes tons of sense..For grass-o-cross...

At least the car could sensibly up-engined to something better than the 22R.. 22RLooks nice in the block and crank but what horrible heads on those...horrible valve train, dumb long rockers, dumb geometry..Just ruins the whole motor..

BUT maybe before we think of crazy potentials--grass-o-cross..
Fapping again..



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LexusFman
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 08:10AM
That's why you go with a 3SGE. Here's a pic I drew yesterday for inspiration
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Ascona73
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 09:57AM
Quote
john vanlandingham
At least the car could sensibly up-engined to something better than the 22R.. 22RLooks nice in the block and crank but what horrible heads on those...horrible valve train, dumb long rockers, dumb geometry..Just ruins the whole motor..

BUT maybe before we think of crazy potentials--grass-o-cross..
Fapping again..

All in all not a bad engine. Bottom ends ARE tough. They can be made to have good power but it's a waste for rallycross.

Everyone wants the older 20R heads on the 22R blocks, but years ago I found that the highswirl 22R heads actually make great power. Gotta grind the swirl/fin thingy right out of the head, but it's still the highest airflow-gain cylinder head I've ever had on a flowbench. With a 1 mm larger intake valve it went from 88 cfm to 134 cfm on the intake ports. Revved to 7500 rpms with a shaved head and a modest cam and 45 DCOE's after that! And still had tire shredding torque down low....

But yea, that's just internet fapping, and unnecessary for dirt-cross. A modern 2.0 litre 16v swap and a steep rear axle ratio would be reliable and fun and all ya need.



Opel is a 4-letter word...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10498579@N07/sets/
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 10:44AM
Quote
LexusFman
That's why you go with a 3SGE. Here's a pic I drew yesterday for inspiration

Obviously..except for playing in a grassy field a trillion miles stock 18 hp ancient 22R in the celica with 3.62 axle and the widest ratio box in the world will work just fine--with stock struts..

Obviously.



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DanielSL
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 10:52AM
Quote
LexusFman
That's why you go with a 3SGE. Here's a pic I drew yesterday for inspiration

My oldest stepson is a JDM kid... Don't know why, but he is. And a good half dozen of my employees are of the age where they think JDM lifestyle and F&F movies are actually how things should be done.
As soon as any of them heard I may stray away from German cars for a project, I was bombarded with the 3SGE black-top Beams, blah, blah, blah.

Almost thinking of finding a LeCar and sourcing a Renault 5 Turbo 2 aftermarket body kit from Europe, at this point. But I really like the idea of at least one RWD in the stable.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/2016 10:54AM by DanielSL.
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tdrrally
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 12:35PM
i like the idea of the celica with the tacoma engines either the 2.4 L 2RZ-FE I4 142 hp (106 kW)
2.7 L 3RZ-FE I4 150 hp (112 kW)

if it's a solid rear axle (6.7) swap it out for an 7.5 or an 8"

or just build a 2wd tacoma



I would rather drive a slow car fast as a fast car slow!
first rule of cars: get what makes you happy, your the one paying for it!
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 03:45PM
Quote
tdrrally
i like the idea of the celica with the tacoma engines either the 2.4 L 2RZ-FE I4 142 hp (106 kW)
2.7 L 3RZ-FE I4 150 hp (112 kW)

if it's a solid rear axle (6.7) swap it out for an 7.5 or an 8"

or just build a 2wd tacoma

Why not actually DRIVE the car stock? Flat field..A gang of happy dreamer amateurs, a cheezoid plaque maybe? ZERO realistic competition..


The Oh Pea needs a new avatar:




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Pete
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Re: Third Gen. Toyota Celica Query
July 05, 2016 04:51PM
Quote
tdrrally
i like the idea of the celica with the tacoma engines either the 2.4 L 2RZ-FE I4 142 hp (106 kW)
2.7 L 3RZ-FE I4 150 hp (112 kW)

Saw a TTE lookalike Celica with the 2.7 dropped in. Disgusting how "stock" it looked. Even the P/S line from the Celica worked with a couple tweaks.



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