Best option for a starter car Part II

Didn't fox's have really weak wheel bearings?

Antoine L'Estage races an AWD/4WDwhatever Hyundai Tiburon which was built and is serviced by John Buffum from what I understand. He won the Canadian Nationals last year.

I'd like to see someone race an Elantra tho!

Ian Crerar races a 911 in G5 Nationally (Canada again). I don't think he's very competitive, although he looks like he has a blast all the time. I've never driven one but I've heard horror stories about how the back end likes to be a pendulum that you can't always control. You're right Porsche did rally them, but if I remember correctly never -at least consistently- got really behind it as a factory effort. A 911 can't be cheap to run.. I wonder just how much you could modify it away from Porsche parts to lower the cost, but who cares really.

I still think that Stingrays are the best rally car ever!

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Andrew M
Onterrible
30ish

JVL was laughing his tea drinking ass off when I told him that I was going to build the CRX for G2.

Many seasons later that same car, affectionately called "The Little Car" by the OTHER sceptic, Mike The Codriver, is still running and refusing to DNF unless the nutt behind the wheel does something dumb.

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Cheers
M.Samli
Phoenix AZ
Gaylant VR4
EVO III GSR (Stolen)


Rallies are no place for traitors

hudson Wrote:
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> Ian Crerar races a 911 in G5 Nationally (Canada
> again). I don't think he's very competitive,
> although he looks like he has a blast all the
> time. I've never driven one but I've heard horror
> stories about how the back end likes to be a
> pendulum that you can't always control. You're
> right Porsche did rally them, but if I remember
> correctly never -at least consistently- got really
> behind it as a factory effort. A 911 can't be
> cheap to run.. I wonder just how much you could
> modify it away from Porsche parts to lower the
> cost, but who cares really.

> Andrew McNally
> Hamilton ON
> 27

Having owned one, and been a member of a local PCA and seen many others, they have many weak points. First one being the shell; everything is paper thin - worse then most street crap. Second is the transmission - not so nice- and generally really big gaps. The stronger Turbo boxes are even worse for gearing. The engines are nice though, make really good power over the whole range. Wheel base too short. Parts are not as expensive as it would seem, the engine is the expensive part really. Porsche has made several million 911's, they aren't as rare as one might think. You could get a VW transmission and bolt up a Ford engine with an adapter. But it would only make the handling worse.

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Scott Manley
Spokane, WA
86' XR4Ti
37

There were 2 '73 911's at sno drift.

Scott Manley Wrote:
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> Having owned one, and been a member of a local PCA
> and seen many others, they have many weak points.
> First one being the shell; everything is paper
> thin - worse then most street crap. Second is the
> transmission - not so nice- and generally really
> big gaps. The stronger Turbo boxes are even worse
> for gearing. The engines are nice though, make
> really good power over the whole range. Wheel
> base too short. Parts are not as expensive as it
> would seem, the engine is the expensive part
> really. Porsche has made several million 911's,
> they aren't as rare as one might think. You could
> get a VW transmission and bolt up a Ford engine
> with an adapter. But it would only make the
> handling worse.

Like I said, I've never driven one.. but they've always struck me as a lot to do about a little. I can see how they are great road course race cars, but even then I've heard horror stories about their handling.. well they look nice and are chick magnets.. what more do you want?

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Andrew M
Onterrible
30ish

I Was driving sweep for MFR 2004 and I saw this car upside down in a ravine at 9pm on Concord Pond stage. Doug got it out, swapped the fluids, replaced the winsheild with Lexan and finished the rally. He was running a custom suspensions setup that he fabed out of Fiberglass of all things.
www.davejenkinscustomhotrods.com is his site. I have some pics somewhere on a cd i will post them when I dig them out.

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Ted DeInnocentis
MK2 Jetta Coupe Rally Car
BMW E46 323i daily driver
Toyota Tacoma Sweep vehicle

Fibre glass suspension? wacky

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Andrew M
Onterrible
30ish

Sorry its www.dougjenkinscustomhotrods.com

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Ted DeInnocentis
MK2 Jetta Coupe Rally Car
BMW E46 323i daily driver
Toyota Tacoma Sweep vehicle

Sure it wasn't just the springs? C4-up Corvettes had fiberglass leaf springs instead of coil front/steel multileaf rear.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

Grand Prix's had a fiberglass rear leaf spring. They break a lot and are a pain to change.

No way, they're cake to change if you have the tool. Half hour or so. 9 out of 10 times they just have the pad on the end disintegrated, which doesn't require replacement to fix.

Fortunately, most of those things are off the road at this point, mo more having to replace the calipers under warranty every six months because they're just a bad design all around.

Lots of Astros have the fiberglass springs, too.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

Goddamn this is the forum that I have been looking for. Great place, and Brian thanks for reccommending this site.

I was reading earlier in this thread about Neons, and I know I might catch hell about them, but I am thinking of using one as my starter car. Myself and a buddy want to build a rally car, and being a 2gnt DSM guy, I know a shitload about the powertrain in these cars. I know some of you wouldn't use one, but as a starter it has to be decent right?

My buddy is a VW guy, so we are looking at dubs as well for starters. Anyhow, great forum, and I will be browsing around it alot to try and learn a bit about rally.

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-Jason
Too close for missiles, I'm switching to guns.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/2007 08:05PM by cc8balla.

cc8balla Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Goddamn this is the forum that I have been looking
> for. Great place, and Brian thanks for
> reccommending this site.

Welcome Jason, we come in peace.
>
> I was reading earlier in this thread about Neons,
> and I know I might catch hell about them, but I am
> thinking of using one as my starter car. Myself
> and a buddy want to build a rally car, and being a
> 2gnt DSM guy, I know a shitload about the
> powertrain in these cars. I know some of you
> wouldn't use one, but as a starter it has to be
> decent right?

What happens if you get bitten and start what I call "pervin' out" and want to start making the basic car really go better? And want to do thing best return on investment? cause if you're here, we gotta presume you're not rolling in dough.
>
> My buddy is a VW guy, so we are looking at dubs as
> well for starters. Anyhow, great forum, and I will
> be browsing around it alot to try and learn a bit
> about rally.

And you know what that VW has available that you will never have the option for if you go the Neon route?
The best return on investment: Rally ring and pinions and if you have some dough, close ratio gears and plate type LSDs.

That's something you can never even think about with many cars cause they simply aren't made.

And without a shorter ring and pinion, IF you ever start pervin out and really wanting to make you car competitive, and I mean the first brand, the first car the one you have to have a cage and suspension that cost bucks for, well you'll be staring at a dead end and will either become disillusioned and sell the car, or drop out (or try tons of expensive "cures".

So think again about the choice: there needs to be real stuff or stuff which will do while you work you way up to real stuff.


>
> -Jason
> Trying to bring interest in rally to Ohio.

Hey 25 years ago Ohio was a hotbed of interest so say bring interest BACK.

Cause the future lies in the past..
(And therefore you ought to think about REAR WHEEL DRIVE!)
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at Feb 24, 2007 by
> cc8balla.

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

John,

Thanks for the input. You are right, I have no money. From what I see rally is all about engineering and ingenuity, and knowing what to spend money on, and what not to. My goal is to learn this, so by reading this forum, and just observing, I think I can.

I think next thing on the list is to sit down with Matt (the guy that wants to build this with me) and figure out a tentative budget, and a tentative list of cars and their pros and cons, and go from there.

Sound good? Apologies to the OP if I hijacked this thread, I didn't intend to.

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-Jason
Too close for missiles, I'm switching to guns.

cc8balla Wrote:
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> I have no
> money. From what I see rally is all about
> engineering and ingenuity, and knowing what to
> spend money on, and what not to.

No need to reinvent the wheel. Starting with something proven is the way to go. Almost every rally person will tell you to buy instead of build. Fuck the money issue, buying will definetely get you out on stages quicker. Some people have done well with Neons (C Bombara for example) after spending 10K+, and I would say very good driving they can beat some stock 16v vws with good driving. No proper diff no proper ratios, no proper rally parts. For 10K you can pretty much buy or upgrade a kick ass vw like the Art Burmeister one. You will hardly see any Neons at a rally but at any given rally at least 4-5 VWs show up. THere must be a reason for it...
And BTW welcome to the Anarchy

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rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!!