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Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations

Posted by 1fastben 
1fastben
Ben Hetland
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Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
November 29, 2014 06:10PM
Hey fellas!

I know I'm not racing anymore, but if you please, I'd like some advice on powerplant options.

I picked up a '73 142 that I plan to build into a fun car, (i.e. not a race car) but I'd still like it to be quick and, if possible, I want to stick with a four cylinder carbureted N/A engine and manual trans...without spending a fortune. It already has a solid, running B20 w/4-spd in it, but from what I've read, it costs a fortune to make even meager power from them. If you have a counterpoint to this, I'm all ears, because I'm very new to the Volvo world.

My goal is roughly 200bhp, or 200 torques, which ever comes first or gets closest.

Does such an engine/manual-trans combo that I want even exist without substantial modification?

If not, but with moderate modification, what other options would you recommend?

Or, options with the B20?



Ben Hetland
1973 Volvo 142 project car (with some cone-smashing on dirt in it's future, however)

"No. Rally Racing is a back alley sport filled with jackals, headhunters and thugs!"
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alkun
Albert Kun
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
November 29, 2014 09:00PM
You want a 200 hp NA motor for your volvo, and you want it cheap? What do you think this is, Turbobricks.com?


Hopped up B20 is a cool motor, there are cams and carbs out there that will wake up a B20, but 200 will take some $ and work.


If you are feeling crafty, get a volvo 740 turbo off craigslist. With minor hacksawing, hammering and a little oilpan swapping, the b230ft will slip right in.


Get over to turbobricks, endure some hazing, and you should be able to find a decent solution.
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Eric Ewert
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
November 29, 2014 10:52PM
Also define cheap. If you are typical turbobricks cheap then im going to laugh at you. If you're willing to spend a few bucks 200hp on a b230 na isn't a problem.

Here is a b230 still on bosch lh 2.4! making your requirements. In fact i may be building something similar or nearly identical to this. With itb's/ standalone in the future.

Take note the valve sizes, the rev limit, the fact that its got an aggressive cam (not a fucking k cam). There is no mention of compression but guessing its at least 11:1. They are saying standard 530 head so maybe there isn't even any porting done to this.

Gearbox... v8 t5 would be required to do a decent job of keeping an engine like that in its power band. If you desired you could mate it to an m45, m46, m47 but wouldn't be as nice to drive. Also according to the internet those boxes will blow up sooner or later. I'm of the same belief.


I have no clue what a turbo one would cost but it is wayyyyy less for the same power. Keep in mind thats coming from me... the idiot who must have an N/A rally engine.

Btw all I have mentioned involves fuel injection.

***ALSO take everything I say with a grain of salt. I haven't actually built a serious N/A volvo engine i've just done a fair bit of research on the matter since I plan on building one for myself in the near future.




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hdBattousai
Austen Waldrep
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
February 12, 2015 03:50PM
Been doing some research on this myself as i'm rebuilding a b23 and was looking for like 230hp n/a with .5 bar on it for turbo 350whp. I'm still a total noob to this stuffs myself but what i've gathered so far is b20 is good for turbo and cheap power due to the narrower piston channels allowing for more boost to be thrown at it with less detonation. a b230 and all the new ones are 2 but bigger bore so more likely detonation at higher boost than as on a b20 (i was advised a b20 is the best block for great turboing with minor mods) If your going n/a strictly then i think you would be better off with a b230 probably along the lines of 16v head, cams, higher compression, better intake, exhaust, everything needs to be properly flowed, new flywheel, 3" tb, ems, injectors, t5 trans and probably a bit more im forgetting/missing.

I was just quoted around 10k$ or there around to achieve this on a 8v b23 so it wont be cheap. I'll be doing it in the future but for now i'm just gonna turbo stroker and look more at 2-3k$ range for more power than i was originally looking at

side thought u ever wanna trade that b20, ill be pulling a b230 soon and probably another b23e as well



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hdBattousai
Austen Waldrep
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
February 12, 2015 03:54PM
oh also if sticking to 8v 531 is better then 530 and for that horsepower chances are you will definitely need quite a bit of machine work done.

T6 volvo engine should meet your goals as well with no mods but 6cyl (got one in my 960 and ALMOST put it in my 240 grinning smiley)
Edit: I believe the t6 is lighter 2 by about 40-60lbs, i could be off on that but i know they are close together in weight.



Quote

GUNS KILL PEOPLE? SO I SUPPOSE PENCILS MISSPELL WORDS, CARS DRIVE DRUNK AND SPOONS MAKE YOU FAT?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2015 04:00PM by hdBattousai.
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john vanlandingham
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
February 12, 2015 05:07PM
Quote
hdBattousai
oh also if sticking to 8v 531 is better then 530 and for that horsepower chances are you will definitely need quite a bit of machine work done.

T6 volvo engine should meet your goals as well with no mods but 6cyl (got one in my 960 and ALMOST put it in my 240 grinning smiley)
Edit: I believe the t6 is lighter 2 by about 40-60lbs, i could be off on that but i know they are close together in weight.

Hi Austen, welcome aboard.
No1; mythbusting.
Fuck the 531 bullshit.
It is like a tiny 1-2 cfm better as cast so its what you want if you are in a class like VOC (Volvo Original Cup---a hugely popular class in Sweden, Norway Holland, Germany where you can mix and match any STOCK part, but no engine mods, can't touch the ports) then maybe 1-3 CFM means something.
It is meaningless when you can clean up ports..
Don't listen to the knee-jerk jerkers.

And the whiteblocks while nice designs are not so nice that ALL THE FUCKING NIGHTMARES of installing one and hooking up some kind of fun gearbox are worth thinking about...because the only easy thjing for them is the "never available in USA" M90 or whatever it was...forgetabout it...

Poor cost/effort/rewards curve.



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

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hdBattousai
Austen Waldrep
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
February 12, 2015 05:19PM
Thanks, and thanks for the invite here!

ahh ok, i knew the valves weren't far off but i was told that there is more material to port in a 531 so i shoulda said higher potential for better flow if i understood it right then again you and half of tb have schooled the crap outta me for the last 2 days straight haha (loving every minute of it 2!)

haha true dat, just tossed it in there cuz other than the wiring, mounts and fab work to fit it, it does meet his power and potentially exceeds it n/a :shrug: then again so does a LSx... sure it doesn't help that everytime i think of one of those i think of the amazon that smoked a ferrari with a twin turbo t6

probably give u a call this weekend 2 john, think im settling up on my engine build and could use your expertise to finalize it so i can hurry up and get on with the rest of the car restoration

Edit: Also did i get the whole b20 vs b230 part right atleast? im still digesting some of what you and others have told me



Quote

GUNS KILL PEOPLE? SO I SUPPOSE PENCILS MISSPELL WORDS, CARS DRIVE DRUNK AND SPOONS MAKE YOU FAT?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2015 05:21PM by hdBattousai.
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john vanlandingham
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Re: Volvo 142 Engine Recommendations
February 13, 2015 12:48AM
B20 is the old 88.9mm x 80mm stroke pushrod motor with cast iron head..
B21 is the first version of the SOHC 8v motor...92mm x 80mm
B23 is the next version of the SOHC 8v motor...96mm x 80mm

B21 and B23 share everything except the pistons and the block..

Same forged steel crank with 2.5" mains and 1.125" rod jounals---dats big stuff, same monstrous "M" rods weighing in at around 890g and 145mm center to center
Same range of piston compression height at 46mm
Same pistons down the bore at TDC by approx 0,6 to 0,7mm
Same 24mm wrist pin

And usually same "flat" flywheel--cast iron---with 215mm pressure plate

Then came the "low friction" B200 (rest of the world) and B230 versions.

Full counterweighted cast iron crank...55mm mains, and 49mm rod journals......that's not bad..
Rods went to soda straws 152mm c-c, the so called "9mm rods"...7mm longer than B20/B21/B23
Pistons were now 39,7mm comp height---15 years after the rest of the world went to comp hgts around that----pin went to 23mm.

Flywheel became a gargantuan 32.5lb "dog dish---stepped--flywheel with huge amounts of iron farthest out, just what you need to hurt the most..Pressure plate and disc size went to 228mm.

At some point in late '89 rods were upgraded from soda straws to pencils with the so called "13mm rods" , in truth an improvement from disgusting to just scary...

At some point the crank main journals went to 62.5mm or about 2.5" like before..

TB lore blabbers about the 55mm main cranks having center thrust journals and people bloviate how that is bad... Bullshit (as usual). The problem is that Volvo used just a half circle shaped thrust bearing per side and it is easier than pie to add a second thrust journal for a full 360 degree thrust if you have any eyes and any brains....

At some point a 16v head was introduced--a very 70s design in that it is a head with valves PLUS a cam box that houses the lifters/buckets/followers and the cams---and it feautures very generously sized intake and exhaust valves---34mm intakes and 32mm exhaust valves. It has a nice combustion chamber with decent quench pad area and stock will outflow any even ported to hell 8v Volvo...And the bonus is that the pent roof design is excellent for flame front propagation---and det resistant..

There is a B204 head, certain Euro markets only, and it goes on the B200 block with just happens to have the same bore---3.5" (or 88.9mm) as the old pushrod b20..
Valves are smaller---32mm and 29mm...interesting but moot because they aren't here.

Block deck height was 231,7mm---same as the old B21/B23 and even B20 as far as i can measure. Bore spacing and head bolt spacing remained unchanged since B18---what came before B20..

that is a nice quick review of the essential details...

Thing is, I'm still not clear what your goal(s) are...and it seems you want 2 distinctly different motors; 1 sensible fine for any playing or even actual competition and daily driving and that's easy and do-able, one totally mental thing for crazy stuff like way over 400hp...which takes a lot more but is do-able as well but different...and costlier...

Some wise guy once said "You cannot serve two masters"....and he was right....

So do some triage and talk about whole car package an budgeting...



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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