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Bersh's 240

Posted by CBersh 
CBersh
Chris Bersheim
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Location: Lancaster, PA
Join Date: 09/25/2015
Age: Party Animal
Posts: 8

Rally Car:
Nissan 240sx


Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 06:06PM
Hello friends,

I'm trying to build a rally car. Its not going well. Its the more round 240, the one from Japan.

To make a long story short, this is cage number two. I'm not having any luck hearing back from the scrutinizers I have contacted.

I know its hard to judge with just a couple of crude photos, but how does it look to you guys?
The main structure, sill bars, and back stays and harness bar are built with 1.75 x .095 DOM tubing. The rest is 1.5 x .095. It looks to conform to all the rules to my knowledge, but I'm still learning my abc's with this stuff. Some of the welds are a little meh, but they have good penetration.

















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hoche
Michel Hoche-Mong
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Location: Campbell, CA
Join Date: 02/28/2006
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Posts: 1,124

Rally Car:
Golf, Golf, RX-3



Re: Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 06:33PM
Assuming that the welds are complete and solid, I would accept that.

I'm not a real big fan of the way the seat mounts are welded to the floorpan - floorpans take a lot of abuse - but it's OK. The way they're all plated at the ends looks pretty good.

I presume the dashbar is high enough that it's not a knee-breaker.



Self-righteous douche canoe
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CBersh
Chris Bersheim
Godlike Moderator
Location: Lancaster, PA
Join Date: 09/25/2015
Age: Party Animal
Posts: 8

Rally Car:
Nissan 240sx


Re: Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 07:23PM
Excellent, I was most worried about the welds.

The seat mounts in the floor turned into a necessity, I was way too high in the car otherwise.

The dash bar is above the steering column.

Thank you for your input.
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hoche
Michel Hoche-Mong
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Golf, Golf, RX-3



Re: Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 08:34PM
Well, I can't really see the welds well (nor check if they go all the way around each tube), but the design looks good and the mounts to the shell look like they're plated decently.



Self-righteous douche canoe
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turoc
Ozgur Simsek
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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working on a Veedub


Re: Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 10:41PM
Is the main hoop a single piece? Not sure if its the me or the pics but that does not seem legal!
Hoche, did you see that?



rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!!
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hoche
Michel Hoche-Mong
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Golf, Golf, RX-3



Re: Bersh's 240
October 13, 2015 11:13PM
It's not the usual way of doing it, but yes it's legal.

See App J Art 253 Section 8.3.1 and Drawing 253-2.



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Dexter
Dexter Clark
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Location: Hemlock, MI
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Rally all of the things


Re: Bersh's 240
October 14, 2015 01:43AM
Subscribed.

Power plant?
Suspension?
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Dexter
Dexter Clark
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Rally all of the things


Re: Bersh's 240
October 14, 2015 01:49AM
Double posted...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/14/2015 01:52AM by Dexter.
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CBersh
Chris Bersheim
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Location: Lancaster, PA
Join Date: 09/25/2015
Age: Party Animal
Posts: 8

Rally Car:
Nissan 240sx


Re: Bersh's 240
October 15, 2015 04:59PM
Quote
Dexter
Subscribed.

Power plant?
Suspension?

For power the plan is a "refreshed" dual cam KA. Id rather focus my efforts on suspension first.

As for suspension; I spoke to Mr, Vanlandingham over the winter when the car was leaving for the first cage. I may end up going that route for as far as struts/spings/mounts go. If hes not around by the time im ready ill try one of the off the shelf setups, but I would rather have a setup made specifically for this car. Im going to be making the multilink arms myself.

I ended up going ahead and painting the cage, it was begining to rust and by now I think its safe to say I will not be hearing from any of the scrutineers I contacted.



I also started my strut tower bracing with a little stitch welding. It took some practice, but I think Im doing alright at it now.


Next up is to make some plates for the tops of the strut towers, then after a little more stitching up near the firewall ill paint the rest of the interior.
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Dexter
Dexter Clark
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Rally all of the things


Re: Bersh's 240
October 16, 2015 02:43AM
I can vouch for JVAB boingers on this chassis. Ian Seppanin has a set on his car and they perform beautifully.
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CBersh
Chris Bersheim
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Location: Lancaster, PA
Join Date: 09/25/2015
Age: Party Animal
Posts: 8

Rally Car:
Nissan 240sx


Re: Bersh's 240
November 19, 2015 07:10PM
Finished stitch welding the bits that I wanted to, and then made some simple little plates for the tops of the rear strut towers. Then reseam sealed, turned out okayish.
Then painted the floor, I hope its not going to be too reflective inside the car... I guess we will find out eventually.

Assembled this hybrid guage cluster, only trained 240sx enthusiasts eyes will notice that its a JDM TYTE YO cluster that I put a usdm speedometer and odometer into.

I picked up an engine with a trans, and harness, and all the other assorted bits for $100. Its a sohc ka24. I was going to hold off for a dual cam, but the tiny amount of power difference isnt going to matter for a longgg time anyway.

It is suprising lovely under the valve cover, I was expecting sludge.
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ElectroTech
Steve Wheeler
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Location: Fork Lake, Alberta
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1992 Golf


Re: Bersh's 240
November 19, 2015 09:10PM
Looks nice man!



Power means nothing if you cannot control it!
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA
Join Date: 12/20/2005
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Rally Car:
Saab 96 V4



Re: Bersh's 240
November 19, 2015 09:12PM
Hey Chris, don't worry. I's around.. Let's talk again..One late suggestion on the cage..I like too add a tube from somewhere near the base of the main hoop diagonally back and UP to that junction of the backstays and the rear X..Weighhs nearly nothing extra but the way I see it it means its harder to displace the rear part cause to move anything there you have to kinda stretch that tube...see?

You looking hard at those various arms in back? That seems to be the biggest thing the other 240--Snissan guys have had actual failures on...In the end I think they made something themselves to be sure it is rally worthy...Shouldn't be too hard, coupla bends and zap zap...

Engine: zat the 3 valve???
I don't think its very hard to find a core 16v head...I lurv them Nissan 16v heads
Without much effort we can see that the 2 big 35mm valve have a whole shit ton more flow and guys get big stiffies about flow cause most think flow equals go...

But the thing I drool about with 16v head is the shape of the combustion chamber and the location of the sparkie plug and the narrow included valve angle of the KA24DE means it has a nice compact chamber---which means it will stand nice high compression--on pump gas---with less tendancy to detonate (after all a lotta guys give them relatively high comp AND fun amounts of turbo boost and boost can be viewed as compression in another form--if they don't det themselves to pieces with comp+ boost, that means they tolerate HIGH comp and not detonate)

So high comp = torque and thats what moves the car (revs just get converted to torque via the magic of gears)

So whatchoo plannin?



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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autronic
Chris Dale
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Location: Newcastle Australia
Join Date: 11/05/2015
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Posts: 11


Re: Bersh's 240
November 22, 2015 08:22PM
The exchange rate to Australian dollars is quite good currently. Would you consider MCA suspension?
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Join Date: 12/20/2005
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Posts: 13,997

Rally Car:
Saab 96 V4



Re: Bersh's 240
November 22, 2015 09:06PM
Quote
autronic
The exchange rate to Australian dollars is quite good currently. Would you consider MCA suspension?

What advantage would that be over the readily available inverted 50 Bilsteins from North AmericaƤs biggest rally suspension supplier who has already done 2 other 240 Nissans one of which has been a consistent Group 5 winner?
What would the cost be?
How much postage cost?
(I currntly have in my car a full set of Golf suspension adressed to a gy here named Staeve Wheeler in Alberta Canada and it will be USD 212 for post just up there...and from the opposite end of the world I can imagine over USD450.)

And where the postage is FAR FAR less and where servie in future is easier and cheaper?

I just refreshed some Proflex struts and the insert rebuild was USD1200 for 4 inserts..or $300/insert.

It is well under $135 for a Bilstein 50 and which it should be noted, has 200mm travel on the fronts vs the Proflex 170mm travel...220 rear vs 190mm.

Another friend waited 9 months for a Proflex rebuild.

There is also a bad taste in many people's mouth about the absolute stonewalling of service from another well known Aussie supplier who claimed "There has never been one DMS unit which has failed in competition"---I have seen the email to their US distributor and the broken shock--fractures in a corner machined with virtually no radius----laying on the desk..



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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