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I Have a Lot to Learn!

Posted by NGTD 
NGTD
Dave Cotie
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I Have a Lot to Learn!
June 17, 2016 10:41PM


Just picked this up today!

Came with a crap load of spares including hood, fenders, front and rear bumper covers, trunk lid and about 16 tires!

Running DMS coilovers, a fairly new JDM Si engine and a JDM ECU.

First thing I have to do is adjust the suspension up and re-install the underbody protection. PO ran a track day so lowered it way down and pulled off the skidplates.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2016 10:42PM by NGTD.
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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
June 18, 2016 12:16PM
Congrats!

looking forward to seeing on a stage near me!
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NoCoast
Grant Hughes
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
June 19, 2016 05:11PM
How much do you want for it?



Grant Hughes
http://rally.build
Denver, CO
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
June 19, 2016 09:09PM
Quote
NoCoast
How much do you want for it?

Just bought it - wasn't looking to sell!
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 05, 2016 08:15PM
So does anyone speak DMS?

I know DMS springs are progressive, but I'm just trying to figure out what I have. The fronts are brand new and the springs are stamped - DSP-KST-550M-240FL. No markings on the rear springs.

Both front and rear springs are only 9.5" uncompressed. There are no tender springs. When I adjusted them to get additional ground clearance the fronts are in the top 1/4 of the threading on the shock body (sorry I didn't measure - I should have). It seems to me that these shock bodies could easily take a 12" or even 14" spring.
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 06, 2016 02:09AM
Quote
NGTD
So does anyone speak DMS?

I know DMS springs are progressive, but I'm just trying to figure out what I have. The fronts are brand new and the springs are stamped - DSP-KST-550M-240FL. No markings on the rear springs.

Both front and rear springs are only 9.5" uncompressed. There are no tender springs. When I adjusted them to get additional ground clearance the fronts are in the top 1/4 of the threading on the shock body (sorry I didn't measure - I should have). It seems to me that these shock bodies could easily take a 12" or even 14" spring.

The normal gravel DMS springs are in the region of 13" long free length..Its late and I hain't going out on the back porch where I have some fronts and rears..Normally they are taper ground wire--a true progressive spring..Nice things for the application, but pricey and lack of a comprehensible rating (Ford used taper ground wire in the Sierras and Escort Cosies and I have several sets of works "909" springs and Ford gave a three part rate: full extension rate, the important mid-stroke and then a final "near the end' rate...) keeps me away..

Did you say what you have for travel in whatever you have?



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 06, 2016 10:13PM
Raining here tonight, but I will pull the spring off and measure the travel later this week.

Will likely be similar to what is here though:

http://www.rallyanarchy.com/phorum/read.php?5,76139,page=1

Honda apparently didn't change much on the pre-strut platforms.

Hard to find information on DMS shocks. All of the stuff on their website is about struts.
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 07, 2016 12:33AM
Quote
NGTD
Raining here tonight, but I will pull the spring off and measure the travel later this week.

Will likely be similar to what is here though:

http://www.rallyanarchy.com/phorum/read.php?5,76139,page=1

Honda apparently didn't change much on the pre-strut platforms.

Hard to find information on DMS shocks. All of the stuff on their website is about struts.

What? Straight struts front and rear..None of the brou ha ha Japonaise copy of some Mercedes or Audi weird ass crap..

I'm being polite about the springs..sumpin is seriously foutu



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 16, 2016 10:58PM
Well according to the folks at DMS NA, the front springs are 550 lbs/in, rears are likely 350-400 lbs/in. The 240 is the free length of the springs in mm, which confirms my measurement.

The front shocks have 135mm - 5.3" of travel and the rears have 145mm - 5.7".

I took the front springs off on one side today and stroked from full droop and I get about 8" of wheel travel before the tire hits the fender liner and the shock was hitting it's bump stop.

The car was being run for track days and has a pretty beefy front anti-roll bar.

Any comments from the Honda guys re - front bar? Disconnect or leave it?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2016 11:08PM by NGTD.
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 17, 2016 09:12PM
Quote
NGTD
Well according to the folks at DMS NA, the front springs are 550 lbs/in, rears are likely 350-400 lbs/in. The 240 is the free length of the springs in mm, which confirms my measurement.

The front shocks have 135mm - 5.3" of travel and the rears have 145mm - 5.7".

I took the front springs off on one side today and stroked from full droop and I get about 8" of wheel travel before the tire hits the fender liner and the shock was hitting it's bump stop.

The car was being run for track days and has a pretty beefy front anti-roll bar.

Any comments from the Honda guys re - front bar? Disconnect or leave it?

I'm presumin' you didn't take out the bump stops--or gummi puffer as the Fritzies call them..
DMS tends to not use the longest puffers in the world but they are probably at least 1.5" long so you could extrapolate another 1" travel.

But dang, mang that's short travel.

You are planning on gravel rally aren't ya?



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 19, 2016 11:11PM
That would give 9" of wheel travel. Yes it's for gravel rally.

Car is a 4 time regional 2wd champion in Quebec, can't be too bad.
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dreamsofjvl
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 19, 2016 11:19PM
Quote
NGTD
That would give 9" of wheel travel. Yes it's for gravel rally.

Car is a 4 time regional 2wd champion in Quebec, can't be too bad.

It sounds about right based on that thread I linked for you that Aaron Luptak posted (strut travel and overall wheel travel) for the max you can get out of a civic double wishbone setup. The spring rates seem REALLY high though. I know the SIR coupe is heavier, but the going rate is about 350 front, 200 rear for a civic hatch of various years.
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 20, 2016 12:32AM
Quote
NGTD
That would give 9" of wheel travel. Yes it's for gravel rally.

Car is a 4 time regional 2wd champion in Quebec, can't be too bad.

Looking at the charts I see the wheel in the rear moves 133mm for 100mm shock travel..
Thats 33% more than the shock.

Front seems to move 153mm for 100mm shock travel
Seems because there is some extrapolations in the calculation..

That SEEMS high

Plugging that in for the travel you mentioned and it SEEMS to come out rear 145 x 1.33= 192,85mm or 7.6" and front 135 x 206mm or 8.13" and that seems rather high.



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 21, 2016 10:37PM
Quote
dreamsofjvl
Quote
NGTD
That would give 9" of wheel travel. Yes it's for gravel rally.

Car is a 4 time regional 2wd champion in Quebec, can't be too bad.

It sounds about right based on that thread I linked for you that Aaron Luptak posted (strut travel and overall wheel travel) for the max you can get out of a civic double wishbone setup. The spring rates seem REALLY high though. I know the SIR coupe is heavier, but the going rate is about 350 front, 200 rear for a civic hatch of various years.

Yes the 550 does seem pretty high, as well as the rear rate that the DMS NA guy indicated that it likely to be. I will have to try to source another spring set, but that is down the road.

I also got a set of road racing springs with it. Based on the size of the spring, I would love to know what rate they are!!

I might be able to run the rear springs on the front and just get a set for the rear since they are more in the range that people were looking at in the thread you linked.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/21/2016 10:40PM by NGTD.
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NGTD
Dave Cotie
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Re: I Have a Lot to Learn!
July 21, 2016 11:18PM
Quote
john vanlandingham
Quote
NGTD
That would give 9" of wheel travel. Yes it's for gravel rally.

Car is a 4 time regional 2wd champion in Quebec, can't be too bad.

Looking at the charts I see the wheel in the rear moves 133mm for 100mm shock travel..
Thats 33% more than the shock.

Front seems to move 153mm for 100mm shock travel
Seems because there is some extrapolations in the calculation..

That SEEMS high

Plugging that in for the travel you mentioned and it SEEMS to come out rear 145 x 1.33= 192,85mm or 7.6" and front 135 x 206mm or 8.13" and that seems rather high.

John, you mentioned charts. Is there an online resource to find that information?
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