Dazed_Driver Banned Junior Moderator Location: John and Skyes Magic Love liar Join Date: 08/24/2007 Posts: 2,154 |
holy hell, that oil sounds awesome *facepalm* Is it good for anything? Or was it a failed idea? |
Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
Thanks Pete...I'll do just that. In the rear I've been using their oil, so I'll do the same up front.
Haven't took apart the rear yet, I'll try that at the next service (testing it, I mean)....desert storm is 2 weeks away. I may have my guy Lars give you a call about setting up the front diff...obviously I want to get it right the first time and not have to go back in there in a month. Hell, I'm going over there tonight and we're gonna try to button this thing up in the next day or two, so you might get a call today. I'll send you a PM. thanks again. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2011 02:36PM by Jon Burke. |
Gravel Spray ------------------------------------------------- Elite Moderator Location: ------------------------------------------------ Join Date: 07/25/2008 Posts: 157 Rally Car: ------------------------- |
In 2007 this French guy calls me up, he works for ET&S racing fuels and states that they had just signed a deal to be fuel supplier for some AMA MC series so they are going to build a plant for blending fuels in the USA and want to start doing NASCAR, Road Racing, and rally fuels as well. Two weeks later the guy calls me up again from Seatac and is on his way to the shop, wants to learn about American rallying and fuel requirements. Long story short dude is a petroleum engineer and wants to talk about engine architecture within the RA rules, how stupid Subaru long bore short stroke is for restricted turbo application, and how AWESOME the Mitsubishi small bore long stroke is for restricted turbo. They had blends for each in FIA GN and offered us some special fuel for each…for free to test. >>>>ANYWAY...while in the engine room at the shop he spots an old dusty can of Redline shock poof on the shelf(we had already stopped using it at that point), dude rolls his eyes and I can see the "stupid Americans" look on his face then proceeds to explain how "stupid" the shit is and why, as JVL said, excessive aeration due to blend and heavy weight, wax that separates and clogs, and the fact that when the wax is IN the oil it’s taking up space from OIL, which prevents OIL from doing it's job LUBRICATING and COOLING the gears working surface as well as the brgs. Imagine smearing pottery clay on your gears, how’s the oil going to do it’s job? I would imagine the stuff was made for highly stressed gearboxes in short sprint type events where the box is ripped every event, in THERORY is sounds good but the reality it doesn’t work, especially for a rally gearbox. The French guys name is Bruno Philippon, and he sent another guy from France a few weeks later, Jarome, with about 55 ENGLISH gallons(not the cheapy american "gallons", half for Subrau called US RALLY 2, and half for Mitsubishi called US RALLY 1. Jarome looked at our cal files for the cars and sugested a few things for the dyno and predicted 10-15% gain. We never used the fuel, 2008 was bad for the rally biz so we never got a chance to put it to work, but meeting those guys was cool, learned a lot talking with them for a day or two.
Man I just rambled on like a lunatic...John... Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2011 02:46PM by Gravel Spray. |
Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
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Dazed_Driver Banned Junior Moderator Location: John and Skyes Magic Love liar Join Date: 08/24/2007 Posts: 2,154 |
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Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
so, I think the whole group should see Kiyo's reply and maybe if a few more rally anarchy peeps get edumacated, that's a good thing, so here's his reply (and you'll just have to deal with the bad japanese ESL)
so, first thing....I've bought a bunch of stuff from him already, he's not trying to sell me anything here, so that's good. 2nd....no vague statements....brings up specifics that he agree's with Pete on (EVO's, honduhs, lotus), and says...."sure, you can adjust with Subaru, but I personally think you can leave it alone." THAT SAID....Pete, I'm still going to call you this afternoon and maybe we can find a nice middle ground here. I've never opened up a diff and played around the insides, sounds like fun, so lets see what we can figure out. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2011 03:52PM by Jon Burke. |
Gravel Spray ------------------------------------------------- Elite Moderator Location: ------------------------------------------------ Join Date: 07/25/2008 Posts: 157 Rally Car: ------------------------- |
the french fuel was used in my lawn mower and also, more appropriately the 2 crf 100's drunk rippin the backyard mx track, I think Nat Stow got a can for his gsxr too.... but he didn't get the broken bones associated with the mx stuff...
This shit went bad in like 3 months, like the mower barely ran/idled bad. Jarome told me 6 months max even if sealed as they use "chemicals" that are "unstable". He also mentioned that they use "chemicals" as they are 99.9% pure, repeatable and reliable energy, most other companies use petrolium based additves which is at best 97% pure, so you have to factor that margin in while mapping, never get the same engergy twice so you can't max out the spark and be confident of the same fuel capacity in the next drum. When I showed him the RA fuel rules he laughed, "weight? weight is all???, oh we have no problems here to add weight, with chemicals" Normally I don't use race fuel after 6 months no matter what, even if it's been sealed. Sunoco 104 is killer fuel, but it goes bad very quick. You can see it on the dyno, fresh new drum peak TQ you can eak out say 21.5' spark, old drum 17' spark before the hammering begins. So when you get a fresh drum from don small and sons, cal the engine to the max on the dyno then later get a rusty drum from some shady barn in PA and you put it in...blammo. If you're not REALLY stressing an engine there is fudge room but if you build and tune an engine to the max on good fresh fuel you had better keep using good fresh stuff. |
Gravel Spray ------------------------------------------------- Elite Moderator Location: ------------------------------------------------ Join Date: 07/25/2008 Posts: 157 Rally Car: ------------------------- |
Jon, yeah Kiyo is right the front diff on a evo is packaged into a tight spot, but the discs are the same size so the result is the same loads. I've seen them fail in the rear of an evo, front and rear of STI's even with there larger plates (6spd & R180). Even track cars have had issues, gravel rally is really hard on them. I'm not saying it's a bad product, real smooth progressive lock but I'd highly recomend you have a look, 3 hours vs DNF and you wont lose any LSD action by swapping plates around.
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Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
sounds like a plan...I gotta go run a few errands and when I get back home I'll grab a note pad and give you a call. |
Do It Sidewayz Chris Martin Professional Moderator Location: Toronto, Ontario Join Date: 01/15/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 567 Rally Car: E-85 powered Impreza |
For what it's worth, i would probably stack the diff a little bit differently so that it's a little bit "softer".
I got a still un indentified front LSD for my Subaru 5 spd, and dropped it in as is. I found it a bunch too "tight", didn't like it much. I had the gearbox out of the car again, and took apart the diff and restacked the plates so that it was a bit "looser", and i liked the behavior of the car alot more. I found the car handled better, didn't push as much, etc. My feeling is if the car was making a PILE more torque than i was, it would be better. I think you are making similar power to what i was back then. I had a very tight rear diff, a 20kg Centre. |
Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
yeah, we did it all last night. Took all of 10 minutes to pull the ring off, un-screw the plate face, re-arranged the plates (pete told me the sequence), and put it all back together.
I was surprised at just how easy it was to do it. Thanks Rally Anarchy, you're the best-est! |
EricW Eric Wages Super Moderator Location: Goose Creek, SC Join Date: 12/09/2008 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 280 Rally Car: 2002 WRX |
Jon,
Don't fuck it up. Even Subaru gets it wrong. This is what happens when you (or Subaru) doesn't set the backlash properly on the front diff bearings: The bearings that fell out of the main bearing assembly were D shaped instead of O shaped when looking along the length of them! Tranny lasted 1.5 miles! |
Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
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Pete Pete Remner Mega Moderator Location: Cleveland, Ohio Join Date: 01/11/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 2,022 |
I love it. It doesn't seem to hurt synchros either. Mind you, I'm using it in transmissions and diffs that use regular old brass synchros, metal diff plates (no "friction material", and no needle bearings anywhere, just tapered bearings and captivated ball bearings. But the stuff does help a trans designed for maybe 40hp wheezers to live behind 210hp/165ft-lb without failing as often. This IS for short run sprint kinda events, too. Gearboxes still fail but it takes a lot longer and it's a much softer kind of failure, with all other gear oils tried the failure mode was metallic crap from the gears flowing through and destroying the bearings. No metallic crap from gears = longer bearing life, good enough for me. I'll probably stop using it in the diff now, though. Don't really have any problems there that gear oil would solve, i just use it because I keep a bunch of it around so it's handy. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2011 05:20PM by Pete. |
Jon Burke Jon Burke Super Moderator Location: San Francisco, CA Join Date: 01/03/2008 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,402 Rally Car: Subaru w/<1000 crashes |
got everything mounted up Tuesday night!
Wed night I got the car running (started up fine after 6+ months of just sitting there....thank god!) and ran through the gears with the car up on jack stands and no load. drained the tranny oil and refilled. Got it out on the street tonight, and SOOOOOO much fun! putted around doing slow figure 8's in the local community college until the po-po showed up and kicked me out, then I did a quick run down I85 and opened it up a little bit......weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!! Group N ratios kick ass!! the gearset itself is a little notchy, I found you either hit the gear just perfect, or you miss it completely and it just sticks and you have to start over, its actually kind of hard to 'grind' the gears. Its definitely noisy...upshifting w/o the clutch is literally 'BANG'....'BANG'.....(and its awesome!) downshifting is actually much smoother and quieter. Thanks for everyone's help, especially Pete! |