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911 Carrera RallyCross Project

Posted by BRAIDusa 
BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
January 28, 2015 06:36AM
And after I installed this new cutch spring I drove it home smiling smiley





Transmission seemed to work fine. Clutch still needs adjusting though. Blows my mind that I can single handedly put back the engine and transmission but it needs two people to adjust the clutch! The speedo doesn't work, probably because I forgot to connect the wires in the transmission tunnel; and the oil gauge is pegged at 5 despite a new sender. Should all be easy fixes. Think I'll drag it up to the Sno*Drift Rally tomorrow.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
February 16, 2015 02:05PM
Was going to update then got bombarded with wheel sales. I bet you're all holding your breath right? Well, I did drive it home that night and I did take it to Sno*Drift. We decided though not to run it as green light as we didn't feel we'd put enough miles on it to risk it. Well, we have now! The car ran like a champ and was a huge hit where ever it went. People were gathering round it like flies round sh...well, you get the picture. Speaking of which, here's a few I found on Facebook, mostly.





Love this one





Not sure what's next for the car. maybe some ice racing.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
June 17, 2015 05:27PM
I just installed the first production 17" BRAID classic wheels on our RallyCross car. 17x8 and 17x9 with 225 and 255 BFG Rivals.











Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
June 23, 2015 03:23PM
Here are a few iPhone snaps I took during a recent photo shoot in Detroit. Proper pictures to follow. Yes, 17" replica wheels!















More here: http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/fe/c=snapfish/l=en_US/p/Organizer/AlbumID=16002306013/a=124138880_124138880/s_c=0/s_mvm=SNP/s_ev20=naturalsearch_0105_google/s_se=FDR/s_pt=MMB/s_cmpg=naturalsearch_0105_google#state=%7B%22pl%22%3A%7B%22uc%22%3A2%2C%22aid%22%3A15341519013%2C%22vp%22%3A%22g%22%2C%22ss%22%3A198%2C%22sb%22%3A5%7D%2C%22ovm%22%3A%7B%22v%22%3A%22s%22%7D%7D



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
July 17, 2015 01:27PM
While the cars racing career is on hold we got it some new numbers to wear so it can help promote the new 17" BZ wheels.





They also fit on the RALIVAN quite nicely

.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
Elite Moderator
Location: La Belle Province, Montreal
Join Date: 03/13/2006
Age: Midlife Crisis
Posts: 578

Rally Car:
Don't Laugh, the Justy is Fun!


Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
July 18, 2015 08:23PM
that is truely anti-cool... sorry so much has been "kinda cool", but-cha just kinda crossed da line.
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
July 18, 2015 08:55PM
Quote
Mad Matt F
that is truely anti-cool... sorry so much has been "kinda cool", but-cha just kinda crossed da line.

LOL



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
September 14, 2015 05:55PM
No exciting modifications or racing exploits to report sorry. The wheel business is keeping me close to my desk. We did get chance to take the car to a German car show recently in Frankenmuth, Michigan called Northernworthersee and won BEST PORSCHE! Our friend Tim's Group B Audi Quattro won BEST EVERYTHING ELSE including BEST OF SHOW. The event was very well attended and included some interesting German specimens along with the usual mix of lowered Golfs and slammed Audis. Here are some pictures and a video at the end.
















.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
October 20, 2015 05:15PM
Because it's only 70f out we decided it was time for winter tires LOL







During the process we discovered this rather worrying damp patch. Could it be the flexible line? Found out one of the mounts is broken too. How much trouble are we in?







Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
October 23, 2015 02:15PM
So to troubleshoot the damp patch we cleaned up the area as best we could. It's not very accessible on the front side and our UR Quattro has squatters rights on the hoist till it's done but we did our best with a floor jack and a flashlight. While doing this we discovered that the outer line was loose where it connects to the oil cooler. We, of course, tightened it up but, not wanting to jump to conclusions and looking for an excuse to test drive the car took it to visit Oakland University's Formula SAE team as they need some wheels for next year's car.





During the "test drive" the oil never got hot enough to open the thermostat to the front oil cooler so that didn't tell us much. We had to let it idle in the showroom for ten minutes more to open it up but we were still not sure if we still have a leak or not. The suspect line is still soaked with oil so we can't tell if it is getting more soaked and the front of the cooler is still caked in dirt and oil and we can't see it. The only hint of a leak was from around the ferrules at each end of the suspect line but we think that was brake cleaner boiling off as oil would just seep and this was bubbling.




So what to do?

a) One idea is "nothing". The car is probably not going to get hot enough to open the oil cooler thermostat till next June and we did find a loose connector which is a pretty obvious red flag.
b) Take the oil cooler out, clean up the connectors and replace one or all of the mounts.
c) Same as above but replace the lines too.

For now I think we will go with b) Agreed?



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
November 18, 2015 04:19PM
So we went with b) Take the oil cooler out, clean up the connectors and replace one or all of the mounts.

The lines were a bit tight. Well, one of them was. Had to use a heat wrench on it but it freed up. The bottom mount that wasn't broken broke so we only had to unscrew the top mount then the cooler came out easily. This left us with a damp oil cooler with two broken mounts. The top mount that was was still attached to the cooler refused to budge; the nut was so rusted as to not resemble a nut at all. So then we had three broken mounts to try to remove. Fun!



The two bottom mounts we drilled out on the drill press. The top mount we hack-sawed off. Then we cleaned out RallyCross debris from between the tubes and we were ready for our new mounts we got from Pelican. Only about $5 each. Some parts for these cars are very inexpensive. Some aren't.








Before re-installing our cooler we wrapped it in cardboard as we wanted to see if it had any effect on oil temperature as we experience what we consider very low oil temperature in the winter. Unfortunately our phone died so we have no pictures. Once the outside temperatures head south our 911 barley gets out of the first notch on the temperature gauge. We were always taught that gauges are designed to read straight up or level when at the ideal temperature or pressure or whatever so you can just glance at them and know everything is OK. So just above that first bar (ours is like on the left) always felt low to us but without numbers on the gauge we never really knew what the temperature was. Then we found this face-plate picture which gave us some clues.



So we were getting around 140F on the coldest days in Michigan when it can be -20F outside. That's actually not as bad as we thought. Then we remembered that the engine thermostat is designed to open at around 185F which means that's the operating temperature Porsche expect the engine to stabilize at. If you look on the face-plates that's not that high up. If it can't manage that it opens the external thermostat and sends oil to the front oil cooerl too; the one we just blanked off. A test drive at 50F resulted in our gauge indicating around 180 with the front oil cooler lines still cold, suggesting that the engine oil cooler was doing its job and our attempts to raise the oil temperature by wrapping the front cooler were both unnecessary and futile as it's not even in play.



This temperature was verified by an infra red thermometer aimed at various parts of the engine. However, when it's really cold out the temperature often never even gets out of the first segment so something else must be keeping it cold.

The first winter we ran the car we don't remember it struggling to make heat. This only started the second winter after the engine had been out and a few "while you are in theres" attended to. We always wondered if we'd accidentally improved the cooling while we were in there but recently realized one other thing we had done to the car since the first winter: added a whale tail. It is now our theory that that scoop is a lot more effective at ramming cold air through the deck lid to the fan and is preventing the oil from reaching proper operating temperature during very cold weather. Therefore our next project is to take off the cladding from the front oil cooler and rig up some sort of restrictor for the deck lid and test in lower temperatures that are surely on their way.

Does all this sound plausible?



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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Perry
Perry Seaman
Professional Moderator
Location: Pittsburgh-ish
Join Date: 12/15/2013
Age: Settling Down
Posts: 36

Rally Car:
motorcycle course vehicle.


Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
November 19, 2015 10:33AM
I'm not familiar with the Porsche details, but it sounds plausible based on my experience with an aircooled beetle. The first year or two that I had the turbo EFI setup on it I used oil temps as the "coolant temp" for the EFI. It would run rich in cold weather because the oil never came up to temp, or even got close unless you really flogged the thing down the highway for a while.

I attended a snowcross once that was particularly cold, and I let the engine run all day, like 8 hours.. and it never reached the oil temp 'warm' threshold of 140F. If I recall correctly, it never got over 120F even with the competition runs and constantly driving it around to try and warm it up.

Here's a factor that might be in play-
The beetle has a temperature bypass built in the engine block. it feeds a small cooler inside the fan shroud. Like most of these bypasses, it is viscosity based and assumes hot oil is thinner. I run a good quality full synthetic in the thing. Back in the engineering office in Germany in the 30s, I don't think synthetic oil was a design concern...
Cold synthetic oil viscosities act like hot dino oil and open the cooler bypass. Viola, slow warm up in all weather and cold oil in cold weather..

Perry



Perry

DRZ400s course bike
KTM 950 ADV
74 Beetle turbo-efi etc..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2015 10:34AM by Perry.
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
November 19, 2015 10:51AM
Ha. we ran the car and the van all day at the last ice race we did. Didn't help the car but the van was toasty when we got in.

We run 20W50 Brad Penn dino oil in it. Ran the same in 10W40 last winter though. Seemed like a good idea.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
November 20, 2015 06:13PM
So, the first attempt (after thinking about it) to add some oil temperature in the winter: block off the engine (primary) oil cooler airflow to some degree, after removing the front (secondary) oil cooler cover we made the other day of course. Here's the bottom of the primary oil cooler. Air from the big fan blows down through this and around the cylinders.






The piece of card we cut to block off most of that flow:




Installed:






And the result after 20 minute sprited driving in ~40F outside temperatures:




Looks like about 170F so not very conclusive but we don't exactly have data on what it normally does when it's 40F outside. At least it didn't overheat. In fact it didn't even open the secondary thermostat.

Next we try it in colder temperatures (excpected over the weekend and/or remove the rear whale tail.



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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BRAIDusa
Paul Eddleston
Godlike Moderator
Location: Birmingham, Michigan
Join Date: 09/06/2012
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 424

Rally Car:
Subaru Outback Wagon EG33, 911 Carrera



Re: 911 Carrera RallyCross Project
November 23, 2015 08:24PM
Went tailless today in an effort to see if the whale tail is contributing to keeping the oil temperatures a bit low in colder weather. It's clear to see how much less restrictive the whale tail and open deck lid combination might be when compared to the deck lid grill.












Now for some cold weather testing just as it's warming up again sad smiley



Paul Eddleston
BRAID Wheels USA www.BRAIDUSA.com
Team Illuminata Motorsport www.teamilluminata.com
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