Rear tubular suspension
Posted by TronDD
Tim Meunier Godlike Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 10/27/2011 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 252 Rally Car: 96 Subaru Impreza |
Grant Hughes Ultra Moderator Location: Whitefish, MT Join Date: 01/11/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 6,818 Rally Car: BMW |
John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
been recommending this for decades. All the way back to the 323 Maz-dog days which like your Sub-a-raty had glorified curtain rods for the links which you could bend by looking hard at them and them grimacing.
You don't have to make tubes at least for the straight tubes...there are off the shelf CrMo swaged tubes for cheap. The big thing is the thangs you poke into the rod ends....they should look like bigger versions of these shock spacer thangs I make: 
The Subie things are 60mm OAL I think...but its something common.. I have some big ones made for 3/4" rod ends with 3/4" holes and M12 bolt size (not 1/2" which is 12,7mm and is sloppy) but like most shit i make I plan ahead for the future so I made 'em so the could be drilled out to 14mm. Like a lot of ideas I show to people these were copied, here's the big ones: 
Now maybe you can get just the plug in spacers, or maybe enough of you poor guys stuck with those thangs can get together and i can do a pure-all-Subie run of them in the sizes needed...and then somebody can take the idea and copy it again--and maybe miss the important details like some I've seen (copies of the shock spacers).... John Vanlandingham Sleezattle, WA, USA Vive le Prole-le-ralliat www.rallyrace.net/jvab CALL +1 206 431-9696 Remember! Pacific Standard Time is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time. |
Tim Meunier Godlike Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 10/27/2011 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 252 Rally Car: 96 Subaru Impreza |
Tim Meunier Godlike Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 10/27/2011 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 252 Rally Car: 96 Subaru Impreza |
John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
Tim Meunier Godlike Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 10/27/2011 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 252 Rally Car: 96 Subaru Impreza |
Clayton McCrary Mega Moderator Location: Olympia,WA Join Date: 07/04/2013 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 161 Rally Car: XRatty purchased. Now build it!! |
John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
You know going up from OEM .0625 stamping to a wall thickness nearly 3 times is much is more than a bit overkill, dontcha? By going up in OD the stuff gets stronger by big multiples even at the same wall thickness... That's why in main hoop we can go 1.75 x 095 rather than 1.5 x .120 Or why 40mm thin wall inverted strut tube is stronger my 2 or 300% than a solid 16-18mm solid bar or stock struts, and why 50mm inverted is hugely stronger than 40mm... The tubes isn't the big issue, 
Or http://www.colemanracing.com/Trailing-Arm-Swedged-Steel-P4054.aspx 
1" OD, .072 wall DOM nor the rod ends http://www.colemanracing.com/Rod-End-34-Male-P4340.aspx Its what you poke in to reduce to the bolt size... You and most of us have 12mm and maybe 14mm and its good to have a proper fit ie 12,2mm ID and 14,2mm.. These swaged tubes above are used of circle track cars weighing min 3500lbs which have 350-800 hp and they are driven hard.. It is no big stretch to figure "Derp derp if'n its good enouugh for those good ol' boys to bang into each with in a 600hp 3500 lb car, it probably ought to hold up in a little Subie or Exsquirt derp!" Or, you really slamming into stuff that hard? John Vanlandingham Sleezattle, WA, USA Vive le Prole-le-ralliat www.rallyrace.net/jvab CALL +1 206 431-9696 Remember! Pacific Standard Time is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time. |
Tim Meunier Godlike Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 10/27/2011 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 252 Rally Car: 96 Subaru Impreza |
Clayton McCrary Mega Moderator Location: Olympia,WA Join Date: 07/04/2013 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 161 Rally Car: XRatty purchased. Now build it!! |
Just thinking of fabricating vs aftermarket stuff that might be expense prohibitive. Also replacement value of a single link is around $6 for tube and $10-15? For joints If I do slam into big stuff, which you all know the green diamond roads that don't get sweeped....have huge gnarly rocks:0 I like building stuff too so it adds personal and fun experience for my edumacation in Rally. Do you think this is too much overkill for the application ? FYI... I always look forward to your opinion 
|
John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
Gotta lear sumpin about learning..Save you education time for shit there is no substitute for. This is simple: the .078 wall things cost nothing and there's nothing to be learned about threading a tube---except how easy it is to fuck up starting not straight..(i do a lot of theading with the part in the chuck and the tap in the tailstock--it goes in straight. So yeah too much overkill and added weight. Better just the right amount of overkill.. Now best would be you go pull a bunch of the parts and do a list or table of the widths of the rod end inserts you need and numbers. Claro? John Vanlandingham Sleezattle, WA, USA Vive le Prole-le-ralliat www.rallyrace.net/jvab CALL +1 206 431-9696 Remember! Pacific Standard Time is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time. |
Clayton McCrary Mega Moderator Location: Olympia,WA Join Date: 07/04/2013 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 161 Rally Car: XRatty purchased. Now build it!! |
Got it, I love light weight but have twisted a few myself on different machines though(insert snowmobile aimlessly careening over a ditch) I know it's not a giant CJ9 off road machine but my thought process was last ability vs weight |
Jeff Reamer Ultra Moderator Location: Marlette, Michigan Join Date: 08/14/2010 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 489 Rally Car: Subaru |
They make dom the perfect size for a 3/4" fine thread tap. I think it is the 120 wall but not positive on that. Either way if you buy the right size you just cut tap and rally. The swedge tubes JVL are talking about are super strong. I have broke a couple over the years. They brake at the swedge. They take major abuse thow. Ive never broke one just racing,more concrete walls and spins with a car hitting you at 70mph type brakes hits.
If you plan on running a rear swaybar you need to engineer a little more then just tubes. I guess you could figure within a turn and set the tow with the front tube. As for the spacers. I made my first set back in 2000 out of 1" aluminum bar stock.I copied them from UB machine who must of copied them from JVL  . I drilled the center to 1/2" then lathed down the end to 3/4" about 1/4" deep. then cut them off at the length I needed them to be.
The only thing ive run into with the bushings is if you take a big hit you will bend the bolts and knock out your toe. Hardened bolts bend to it just makes it tuffer to cut them out after there bent so use a softer bolt. The sheer strentgh of a 12mm bolt is super high but the do bend easier now that every thing is solid. First rally 2013 Rally car type AWD subaru Total rallies as driver 6 Total rally cars built 2 Total rally cars caged 3 Total rally cars repaired from offs 4 Total years racing exp other then rally 19 yrs Like 31motorsports on FB! Check out 31motor sales on ebay for used Subaru parts |
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.