Welding to cast iron on regular jack stands for pin mount.

Alright... I really didn't think this entirely through before I did it, had off work today and had a 'doh' moment. The reason I wanted to do regular jack stands is that they are adjustable.


Anyways, I'm going with the better safe that sorry approach on this one. 1" solid pin. I've seen some of others pinmounts and they just look sketchy to me. I want to be able to use it for everything not just changing tires at service.

I was going to notch out the U on the jack stand weld it; then put a 1/4" plate over the top to kinda box it in. So I started grinding the material out, just realize hey this isnt steel. It's cast iron. I did some test welds, 220 machine on full power and I was getting pretty good penetration. Pre-heated with a map torch. Honestly it welds like steel, maybe a slight more spatter.

Now the welds will look good but that doesn't mean they are... just looking for a little reassurance haha. I guess I could always do it and drop the car from 4" if it holds were good type of thing.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/2013 11:54AM by czwalga.

I dunno if I'd crawl under it ..

There are some decent ones I found that had mild steel parts that could be welded to. They were $60 each IIRC and your could buy extra inserts for them.. Must dig them up. Would run about double the HF 6 tons that would be about the right size for this job.

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This isn't floor mat anarchy

Yeah thats actually what i'm using the HF 6 tons.

I've seen people just rest the bar/tube/pipe on the jackstand, no welding. That way you can still use them as normal jackstands if you want.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

Quote
czwalga
Alright... I really didn't think this entirely through before I did it, had off work today and had a 'doh' moment. The reason I wanted to do regular jack stands is that they are adjustable.


Anyways, I'm going with the better safe that sorry approach on this one. 1" solid pin. I've seen some of others pinmounts and they just look sketchy to me. I want to be able to use it for everything not just changing tires at service.

I was going to notch out the U on the jack stand weld it; then put a 1/4" plate over the top to kinda box it in. So I started grinding the material out, just realize hey this isnt steel. It's cast iron. I did some test welds, 220 machine on full power and I was getting pretty good penetration. Pre-heated with a map torch. Honestly it welds like steel, maybe a slight more spatter.

Now the welds will look good but that doesn't mean they are... just looking for a little reassurance haha. I guess I could always do it and drop the car from 4" if it holds were good type of thing.

Been nice knowing you.
Hope the will is in order, at least tell your family why---survivors always wrestle with the "why" when people kill themselves, so tell them why you want to die, tel them it's you, not them...

See you in the next incarnation.
Like oum dood.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Quote
Pete
I've seen people just rest the bar/tube/pipe on the jackstand, no welding. That way you can still use them as normal jackstands if you want.

You have a good point. I'd essentially be doing the same thing, just holding the pins in place with the weld. Even if the weld did happen to break its going to catch itself.


JVL, haha thanks for the eulogy. What pete said makes sense, I dont think it should be any probem, would just be like insert the 1" pin without it being connected to anything and setting the jack stands under it, except it would just be secured from moving around.

I always thought it'd be a good idea to tack a couple big washers on the bar to locate it on the jackstand so you don't have to have several inches sticking out. 1" ID washers are maybe 75 cents a pop at the hardware store.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

Quote
Pete
I always thought it'd be a good idea to tack a couple big washers on the bar to locate it on the jackstand so you don't have to have several inches sticking out. 1" ID washers are maybe 75 cents a pop at the hardware store.

Plus, might keep the bar from slipping off the stand if bumped, which could be a bad day. But I think that you should do it the right way with custom stands.

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"Talk about drugs. Driving a car like that, going that fast, it’s like all the drugs at once." - Tommy Byrne

"Now, Pinky, if by any chance you are captured during this mission, remember you are Gunther Heindriksen from Appenzell. You moved to Grindelwald to drive the cog train to Murren. Can you repeat that?" - The Brain

I like Pete's idea with the washers but would instead use two 3/16" side plates that extend downward and outward from the 1" pin by 2" or more and through which the pins stick; weld the plates onto the pins. These will 'bracket' the 1" pin on either side of the top of the stands, and you could even do a light tack of the plates to the stand. The reason to use these heavy side plates is that they will make the pin set on the top of the stands in a very stable manner, and restrain the stands from tipping over sideways if the car is bumped.

I assume JVL's warning has to do with the uncertain grade of the iron, but he is not very specific on that point.....

Make your own insert for something like this:

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200358558_200358558

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starion887
I like Pete's idea with the washers but would instead use two 3/16" side plates that extend downward and outward from the 1" pin by 2" or more and through which the pins stick; weld the plates onto the pins. These will 'bracket' the 1" pin on either side of the top of the stands, and you could even do a light tack of the plates to the stand. The reason to use these heavy side plates is that they will make the pin set on the top of the stands in a very stable manner, and restrain the stands from tipping over sideways if the car is bumped.

I assume JVL's warning has to do with the uncertain grade of the iron, but he is not very specific on that point.....

God it should be evident.
Iron is notoriously difficult to weld.
Big herking fat iron and a 1" bar sounds evebn worse than just welding a crack.. Shape of part to be made could not be worse if you tried: vectors, resolving loads, embrittlement, penetraition, consequenses or any of these being wrong, or several, or all.

Iron has its uses, and is good for a lot of things but getting welded on isn't one of them..especially by inexperienced welders used to the ease of steel.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Thanks John. I really do appreciate good info; it's not evident to me (and probably to many) as I have never welded on iron. I once brazed up a crack on an old Ford 292 cast exhaust manifold.....but that's the extent of it. Regards....

what about making a new part that slides into the stand and has the pin for the car ?
you could use steel and know its safer to a level.

or fab a new stand that is purpose built for the job

like this
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_aQZI2Ch3jho/R1PK8ntqNdI/AAAAAAAAAfA/eQgi9T2mCJk/s1600-R/Rally%2BGB%2Bservice%2Bpark.jpg

i would bet steele solutions could make something up to the job

---

I would rather drive a slow car fast as a fast car slow!
first rule of cars: get what makes you happy, your the one paying for it!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/03/2013 02:42PM by tdrrally.

Quote
starion887
Thanks John. I really do appreciate good info; it's not evident to me (and probably to many) as I have never welded on iron. I once brazed up a crack on an old Ford 292 cast exhaust manifold.....but that's the extent of it. Regards....

Well shit, I forget that sometimes. believe or not there are good electrodes for stick welding iron with no pre-heat or post heat.. My own heads on my Saab have a big herking cast dubble outlet welding where the original siamesed single outlet was milled away.
Cold welded with no pre or post heat

This is fun to see what was done so the little pushrod V4 could go and fight with nasty Fords and Opels,
Ported OEM head:




Group 4:


See the weld?


Done cold.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Fyi if anyone cares how they turned out. Probably overbuilt, I went with a 1" pin, but very little weight difference on the car. Rather not have to worry about the pin yielding of something gets dropped or whatever.








Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/2013 07:50PM by czwalga.