Who can build me a rally car?

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 10:46:58 -0500

Quote
Greg Donovan
John, how hard is it to replace rocker panels on 240s?

A car like this red one here would be at least 1200 here in Midwest.

Good morning...ugh long day yesterday. Up at 0600 for an MRI, then drive thru downtown traffic to drop wifey of, then drop 30 new strut tubes off in Mukeltio for the pretty plating, they pop into Pull-a-part to look for cam belt tensioner ideas---and check inventory like the Camaro T5 (V6)---then to Jake the CNC mill guy to pick up the Soooper Bitchin 15 lb STEEL flywheels, then home foe a while , pick up wifey (late!) back home grab a bite and then zoom down to IKEA cause we had to get something better to sleep on, so schlep up a new mattress at 21.30...then turn on email all while nearly, almost cross-eyed from this bulging disc...

Greg, you hit the nail. Replcing the whole length of the sill is the key..
sheet metal is cheap, so don't fiddle faddle making patches, cut out whole parts. stitch in new.

I've not done a 240 but I've done 2 sills , 2 floor sections, a traverse seat support cut and welding, and primed in 16 hours, sipping tea.

By the way, with a leaky trans, and a STACK of 20s, that car can be had for less.
Were it not so shiny, 100 dollah!

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 05:27:30 -0500

John, how hard is it to replace rocker panels on 240s?

A car like this red one here would be at least 1200 here in Midwest.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 00:33:04 -0500

Quote
WRCWRXSTI

Quote
john vanlandingham
How old you say you were?
Old enough to rally! And vote! And... oh wait that's at 21.

well? didya call 'em?
Come on mang its RED and has round headlights!!

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

WRCWRXSTI — Wed, 20 Jul 2011 00:24:11 -0500

Quote
john vanlandingham
How old you say you were?

Old enough to rally! And vote! And... oh wait that's at 21.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Tue, 19 Jul 2011 19:03:16 -0500

Here's a likely victim, the good sort w round headlights:
http://eugene.craigslist.org/search/cto?query=Volvo+242&srchType=A&minAsk=&maxAsk=

Found: 1 Displaying: 1 - 1

Jul 18 - 1977 Volvo 242 - $600 (Eugene) pic

Date: 2011-07-18, 9:07PM PDT
Reply to: sale-8kzs4-2501536142@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]
1977 Volvo 242 4 cylinder automatic
The Good
new tires, new starter, new alternator, new fuel pump, new brakes, new struts, Pioneer CD player.
The Bad
has transmission fluid leak-needs automatic transmission serviced 100.00, drivers side window doesn't roll all the way up, windshield cracked, odometer and speedometer broken.
This is a super fun, cute, classic car. We have put tons of work into it and would never let it go if we were not moving out of state at the end of the month.

* Location: Eugene
* it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests

image 0 image 1

There's a Borg warner T5 is a Camaro in Lynwood GM section as of 3 hours ago---55 bucks.

And you could pick up this one for me in Eugene:
$100
TRANSMISSION FOR SALE! IF INTERESTED CALL OR TEXT 541-539-0501

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

xrian — Tue, 19 Jul 2011 16:29:45 -0500

My car is still available!!!!!! She's still as she was run in Targa NF
Tons of spare bits and an available trailer.

Call if interested.
905-650-5889

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Wed, 29 Jun 2011 10:38:17 -0500

Further, ask and think hard:
Can whatever the fuck junk somebody is selling EVER be able to do this:

THIS is the essence of the yee-haw thing that is best at keeping people in the rally relationship for long enough to eventually build a decent car with power and good drive train AND accumulate the DRIVING SKILLS that you---and everybody else---weren't born with --none of us were.

But can the turd little whatever somebody is pushing you towards ever be capable of just what that Volvo is doing?

Because you CAN progressively build a Volvo or Xratty to have the performance you see there, and you can do it a lot easier than in some flimsy shitbox fwd car...

Again---note-I have ONLY rallied FWD, but a GOOD light strong fwd car.
Nothing wrong with fwd, but it will never do THAT above.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Wed, 29 Jun 2011 10:13:07 -0500

Quote
WRCWRXSTI

Quote
Billyee
There are a good amount of rally cars for sale in the NW currently, would save you a bunch of money over building one.
yeah i think im starting to realize that is going to be the best route for me. i think id have a much easier time saving up 8 grand for a used rally car than slowly spending 9,10, 11, or 12 grand to make my own. next time ill build my own. but honestly, where do you find ads or any sort of notification that a rally car is for sale in the northwest? only place i have found so far is specialstage.

Maytbe you should slowly realize that ultimately you will have to work on cars, unless you are very wealthy.

And maybe you should quickly realize that some peoples figures are for the LATEST and "trick-est " looking seats, and ($700 ea vs $200 for a pair second hand).

Further, maybe it should be instantly obvious that the decision one way or another should not be made on the basis of a few highly THEORETICAL words of total strangers on a forum.

And that sooner rather than later you need to (gasp! say it hain't so!) drive over and talk face to face with some locals, preferably some locals with some amount of experience observing the whole process of lots of people entering the sport, their "arc' or trajectory thru the time they were active, what kept them IN the sport, till why and when they eventually dropped out.

Then think what you want to do.

The "buy a (potentially--maybe probably used, near stock, hatchet job thing needing complete do-over in all critical areas) car, it's quicker" is all about instant gratification, not about building a solid foundation to have a sustained period of learning and growth.

You gotta think about what you want to do. (And what resources you have to accomplish, whatever it is)

How old you say you were?

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

WRCWRXSTI — Wed, 29 Jun 2011 01:48:10 -0500

Quote
Billyee
There are a good amount of rally cars for sale in the NW currently, would save you a bunch of money over building one.

yeah i think im starting to realize that is going to be the best route for me. i think id have a much easier time saving up 8 grand for a used rally car than slowly spending 9,10, 11, or 12 grand to make my own. next time ill build my own. but honestly, where do you find ads or any sort of notification that a rally car is for sale in the northwest? only place i have found so far is specialstage.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Billyee — Tue, 28 Jun 2011 23:45:32 -0500

There are a good amount of rally cars for sale in the NW currently, would save you a bunch of money over building one.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

BillyElliot — Tue, 28 Jun 2011 20:57:57 -0500

When I bought my $2900 GTI, I think I was up to $8000 when I updated it to my liking

Engine tune up
New calipers/rotors/lines
New underbody protection
Cage updates
Pair of Sparco PRO ADV seats + new harnesses
Intercom
First aid
Spill kit
Roof scoop.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Tue, 28 Jun 2011 09:51:41 -0500

Quote
Gravity Fed
i bought a "used" rally car, but the savings are seriously astounding. I bought the weaver, formally herados, formally who the hell knows, rx7 for 5000. Turn key basically ready to go. Plus many of the things you would need to buy otherwise, are then transferable from this car if i one day ball the heck out of it. But all the little "bits" that make the car better are usually all figured out for you and presented a such a low cost since they just come with the car. Hell i would be curious to know just how much it costs for HDPE to cover the car properly...

only things i did do was clean it out and reorganize the med kit, spill kit, etc into new bags and different attachement methods. Its very pleasing to also just be able to fire it up and drive. It keep you motivated.

you got a good car. however for every good one there are 3 or 4 headcases out there.

caveat emptor and all that.

(thanks mister brady!)

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Gravity Fed — Tue, 28 Jun 2011 09:45:00 -0500

i bought a "used" rally car, but the savings are seriously astounding. I bought the weaver, formally herados, formally who the hell knows, rx7 for 5000. Turn key basically ready to go. Plus many of the things you would need to buy otherwise, are then transferable from this car if i one day ball the heck out of it. But all the little "bits" that make the car better are usually all figured out for you and presented a such a low cost since they just come with the car. Hell i would be curious to know just how much it costs for HDPE to cover the car properly...

only things i did do was clean it out and reorganize the med kit, spill kit, etc into new bags and different attachement methods. Its very pleasing to also just be able to fire it up and drive. It keep you motivated.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

BillyElliot — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 17:38:55 -0500

I'd double for the Honda crew on a good platform to build from. What is your budget?

Here's a "basic" build price. I'm probably missing some stuff, so people can add to the list. Sure you can get more/less on each but it's a rough estimate:

$2500-$3500 cage
$700 x 2 for seats (I think OMP is the cheapest at $700 a piece with head wings)
$400 for harnesses
$100 for extinguishers/triangles/first-aid kit
$300-$600 for underbody protection
$260 for a Peltor
$70 for a brake line limiter
$100 for misc fuel/brake lines
$100 for braided stainless lines
$400 for brake pads
$30 hood pins
$30 map light
$400 4x Hella lights.

So you're at ~$6000-$7000 in BASIC parts that you can add to any car. Pretty much all that cost could be covered with some extra labor for install. You'll still need to add a suspension to the mix, but you can look at spending anywhere from $1500 to $15,000+ for that.

But back to my original question... what's your budget? You want a $70k R2 or do you want a $10k beater? As much as the media seems to say, there aren't $500 rally cars. Take any $3000 donor car and attach the basic list above and say a modest $2500 for a suspension and you're already at a $13k car. Shells for just about any car can be found for $1500 or less, just add motor trans. You're blessed with less rust than someone like me in the Midwest, so you can get even cleaner donors for cheap.

To mirror Sean's Merk build for $20k... adding another $7k to a Civic build from above can get you quite a bit as well. ~200hp at the wheels, 2400-2500lbs, close ratio gearset, Honda reliability (i.e. change the oil and that's it). Honda parts are ALL OVER the place. Proper close ratio kits are $750 (no need for final drive in some cases). Final drives are $550. Diff is anywhere from used OEM/Quaife (DO NOT BUY OBX) up to OS GIKEN $$$tuff.

I was thinking of building a beater Civic with the 127hp 1.6 SOHC motor as a rental car, but there isn't much of a market for rentals... yet.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

WRCWRXSTI — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 12:41:46 -0500

Quote
john vanlandingham

Quote
aj_johnson

Doh! I was thinking fox mustang guy. No shit if you are that friggen close, what is taking so long? Rent a car hauler for a day and move some cars.

I still think the running, caged idea was a good one tho, That's 70% of a rallycar project right there.

Well he doesn't need to rent a truck and hauler cause he can barrow a nice diesel van and dolly from me.
Same as William did years ago.
Problem is the ferry charges about one million dollars for a van, dolly and car.

And he needs sumpin that runs so he can avoid the million dollar ferry charges and has NO storage.

That island is small, and is really a resort island so the square footage is at a premium---the space a car takes up could be rented to yuppies from Seattle for a thousand bucks a week...

I really don't know hows he's thinking he can do a project of any sort on the island, even if the major build is done elsewhere there's constant revisions, improvements, fixin and fiddlin to do and that means a space to work---along with REPAIRS. Oi.

hey john, i actually have some space to work on the car with. possibly even a garage in the near future. i just dont really have a place to store a shell rite now.

william, i may just use the van and dolly so i can get it out of there for you :)

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

SteelSolutions — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 12:10:53 -0500

Quote
derek
In the Seattle area these people can build you a rally car:

Dave Clark (likely built more then the rest combined)
Pete Vanbogart (Cascade Motorsports)
Derik Nelson
Doug Chase
Robert Golbrech

Ya there is no lack of very good car builders I don't like building them
I love making parts for them. My plate is full for a good 6 weeks,
And I want to work on my focus.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

derek — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 11:48:25 -0500

In the Seattle area these people can build you a rally car:

Dave Clark (likely built more then the rest combined)
Pete Vanbogart (Cascade Motorsports)
Derik Nelson
Doug Chase
Robert Golbrech

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 11:29:39 -0500

Quote
aj_johnson

Doh! I was thinking fox mustang guy. No shit if you are that friggen close, what is taking so long? Rent a car hauler for a day and move some cars.

I still think the running, caged idea was a good one tho, That's 70% of a rallycar project right there.

Well he doesn't need to rent a truck and hauler cause he can barrow a nice diesel van and dolly from me.
Same as William did years ago.
Problem is the ferry charges about one million dollars for a van, dolly and car.

And he needs sumpin that runs so he can avoid the million dollar ferry charges and has NO storage.

That island is small, and is really a resort island so the square footage is at a premium---the space a car takes up could be rented to yuppies from Seattle for a thousand bucks a week...

I really don't know hows he's thinking he can do a project of any sort on the island, even if the major build is done elsewhere there's constant revisions, improvements, fixin and fiddlin to do and that means a space to work---along with REPAIRS. Oi.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

aj_johnson — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 10:17:43 -0500

Quote
Greg Donovan
worst part is he doesnt need to fly across the country to get it. they are both pretty damn close together. john is on in island up by victoria BC and william is in redmond. if i were that close both the XRs would be at my house by now instead of the impreza.
quote]

Doh! I was thinking fox mustang guy. No shit if you are that friggen close, what is taking so long? Rent a car hauler for a day and move some cars.

I still think the running, caged idea was a good one tho, That's 70% of a rallycar project right there.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

john vanlandingham — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 10:06:48 -0500

Quote
WRCWRXSTI

so it drives? i could drive it home tomorrow and then get the seal fixed? or does it leak oil like crazy?

It drives.
You press a seal into a seal holder and bang it in before you drive home.
I put a link already. $6.50 to $8.50

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 10:02:09 -0500

Quote
aj_johnson
William,

Give him a dollar amount for a running driving XR caged rallycar. Something he can fly across the country and drive home. You have a car you need to get rid of, he needs a car.

Sell him a Caged, Running, Driving rally car, with something slightly better than a milk crate to sit on and let him do the rest of the safety, motor, suspension and brakes. Put a little elbow grease into it and you guys should work out a deal.

worst part is he doesnt need to fly across the country to get it. they are both pretty damn close together. john is on in island up by victoria BC and william is in redmond. if i were that close both the XRs would be at my house by now instead of the impreza.

maybe john (not JVL john) can kick in some extra cash and a little sweat equity some afternoon to get the car fixed and drive it home. that way he can start to get intimate with the car, get to know some of the rally people in the area and learn a thing or two.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

aj_johnson — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 09:44:48 -0500

William,

Give him a dollar amount for a running driving XR caged rallycar. Something he can fly across the country and drive home. You have a car you need to get rid of, he needs a car.

Sell him a Caged, Running, Driving rally car, with something slightly better than a milk crate to sit on and let him do the rest of the safety, motor, suspension and brakes. Put a little elbow grease into it and you guys should work out a deal.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

SteelSolutions — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 08:05:17 -0500

No it needs some loven too bad you have to drive it home that elliminates a ton of potential good deals.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

WRCWRXSTI — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 03:46:44 -0500

Quote
SteelSolutions

in all seriousness you could get a basic starter car for around 9 grand on top of the purchase price of the shell.

also, it should be noted that the 9 grand price doesn't do anything with engine, trans or brakes.[/quote]

That Xr I got would be one of the cheapest routs you can go.
I told you the list of part that are on it
large van and computer
Welded rear diff
T5 swap
Cut and welded driveline
Hydrolic clutch
Fresh motor, hone, rings, bearings, valve springs, valve seals, light porting just clerk the crud. Castings past the valves, ported exhaust,
Cosi housing intercooler
Saab radiator twin fan
Rx7. Oil cooler with quick fit lines and remote filter
Rotated intake
Matched and cleaned injectors

Add all that up I want 1000 so I can move forward on my focus
You don't have to take the second shell I can get rid of it

Soo 1000 there
I think you can do a cage
safty stuff for under 6500 with the car
By the time you spend 9000 you will be on your way to a bitchin xr[/quote]
so it drives? i could drive it home tomorrow and then get the seal fixed? or does it leak oil like crazy?

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

SteelSolutions — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 02:24:52 -0500

[/quote]
in all seriousness you could get a basic starter car for around 9 grand on top of the purchase price of the shell.

also, it should be noted that the 9 grand price doesn't do anything with engine, trans or brakes.[/quote]

That Xr I got would be one of the cheapest routs you can go.
I told you the list of part that are on it
large van and computer
Welded rear diff
T5 swap
Cut and welded driveline
Hydrolic clutch
Fresh motor, hone, rings, bearings, valve springs, valve seals, light porting just clerk the crud. Castings past the valves, ported exhaust,
Cosi housing intercooler
Saab radiator twin fan
Rx7. Oil cooler with quick fit lines and remote filter
Rotated intake
Matched and cleaned injectors

Add all that up I want 1000 so I can move forward on my focus
You don't have to take the second shell I can get rid of it

Soo 1000 there
I think you can do a cage
safty stuff for under 6500 with the car
By the time you spend 9000 you will be on your way to a bitchin xr

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 02:22:59 -0500

oh, and lots of people can build you a rally car. but do your homework. cheap aint always better.

there are many in your area.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 02:20:47 -0500

Quote
SteelSolutions
With Rwd you tend to be able to get upraded parts cheaper,
Ring and pinoin, close ratio gear kits, limited slips.
This would be a personal list of cars I would get
Honda civic coups or hatch 92
Merkur Xr
Volvo 240
Nissan 240
Focus for my Rwd plans
Any log booked subaru and do the quick and dirty Rwd to it
Ae86
Bmw 318ti or any e36 shell

good advice.

with all the time i have spent planning i have learned that it is best to start out by building a rally car around the drivetrain.

there are cars that are expensive to upgrade and operate. a cheap little suziki swift might be tempting but wait untill you try to find a close ratio gearset and a LSD for it. ouch.

there are also cars that are cheap to upgrade. the volvo 240, xr4ti and subaru (for AWD open light non turbo) come to mind for this path.

which one do you want?

remember that cheap and expensive are VERY relative terms in this context.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

SteelSolutions — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 02:04:22 -0500

With Rwd you tend to be able to get upraded parts cheaper,
Ring and pinoin, close ratio gear kits, limited slips.
This would be a personal list of cars I would get
Honda civic coups or hatch 92
Merkur Xr
Volvo 240
Nissan 240
Focus for my Rwd plans
Any log booked subaru and do the quick and dirty Rwd to it
Ae86
Bmw 318ti or any e36 shell

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

Greg Donovan — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 01:48:49 -0500

Quote
WRCWRXSTI
what about for a fwd or rwd car with a little less horsepower? im actually very willing to buy a car but i havent been able to find any online within like 2000 miles...

you will find that the type of car has very little impact on the minumum cost of building it into a rally car.

there are certainthings that cost a minimum amount regardless of make, power and driveline configuration. things like cage, seats, harness and basic safety requirements being among them.

in all seriousness you could get a basic starter car for around 9 grand on top of the purchase price of the shell. of course it can be done for less, or more... it all depends on what you need/want and what you can do yourself. your choices are good, fast and cheap. pick two.

also, it should be noted that the 9 grand price doesn't do anything with engine, trans or brakes.

Re: Who can build me a rally car?

WRCWRXSTI — Mon, 27 Jun 2011 00:43:42 -0500

what about for a fwd or rwd car with a little less horsepower? im actually very willing to buy a car but i havent been able to find any online within like 2000 miles...