DooWop stuff

Doug Heredos Wrote:
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> Wow, Gene. You're my hero!
>
> Doug

Gratuities gladly accepted.

Wilson, I couldn't have said it better myself. Sad times.

hate to call ya'll whiners, after Gene said you're winners,
but according to the early sched.
this party doesn't kick off untill 11AM.

you dont have to get up early to have your ass kicked by Adam.
route book or no.

---

"I put the hurt on dirt" - adam crane
http://CraneRallyCrew.com
corolla gt-s "Patches"
Op: S.S.

acrane Wrote:
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> you dont have to get up early to have your ass
> kicked by Adam.

What, into the creek again?

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Self-righteous douche canoe

I thought that the NW used the Modified FIA timing system (aka Canadian timing system). In the supps just posted it says that it will use the "NW Timing System". Is there a subtlety between the two that I'm missing? Emergency time maybe?

Cheers,
Anders

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Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

The NW system gives you a road time from ATC to ATC. Fast stage time gives longer transit time. Slow stage gives short transit. I believe Canada has a seperate transit time. NW system keeps the rally tighter at the penalty of new ralliests and anyone having an issue on stage. Lots of complaints at nationals. I believe RA has finally required our national to run the "normal" system. Mostly it's been a Forespring thing. He has publicly stated that our volunteers won't work an event with the standard system, even tho they work Oregon, Cali and Canadian events ...Finally the chief of controls called BS on the whole thing and PRG switched for the national.

I don't know if the NW will switch and use one timing system for all events or have a confusing mix.

I like the method used here in the NorthWest.

Our rallies run on time mostly.

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JohnLane

Overkill is consistently more fun

Anders Green Wrote:
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> I thought that the NW used the Modified FIA timing
> system (aka Canadian timing system). In the supps
> just posted it says that it will use the "NW
> Timing System". Is there a subtlety between the
> two that I'm missing? Emergency time maybe?

The NW Timing System is described in the supps for Wild West and Olympus. You should be find either one online.

The NW Timing System is pretty much the FIA timing system, not the Canadian Modified FIA system.

Ok, I know how the FIA timing system works, (and I've just read the NW Timing system from olumpus supps) so from the descriptions given in the DooWops supps, the difference is that instead of a atc-atc time given, you're given two separate times, stage and transit, and you always add them for an atc-atc time. You never use those numbers independently. That's what's confusing me, I guess.

Separate from that issue, what are the differences between NW timing and FIA timing? They seem identical in function.

Anders

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Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

Anders Green Wrote:
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> Separate from that issue, what are the differences
> between NW timing and FIA timing? They seem
> identical in function.

I think they are. The example time card typically used in the supps for PRG events is the Rally Finland card, so I bet that, except for details (like being allowed to declare early at a MTC In), they are the same.

I was reading through the FIA rules this morning trying to figure this out and discovered that FIA has reorganized the rally rules. The old General Prescriptions for Rallies appears to have been replaced with WRC General Prescriptions. So, I couldn't find the answer.

alan

The issue with "our" system is the variable transit time. If you have a bad stage time then you get a short transit. So you risk gettin it the ass twice, once on stage time and then again on road points. It encourages speeding on transits. I believe the Canadian system is a combo of the FIA and US system. Alan??
Competitors should always have adequate transit times.

Beyond that , every other rally community in the US somehow gets by on the "other" system. If we want to host a national event then I believe we should use the same system that the visiting drivers will be used to. Actually I think we should all go to the Canadian system if it was explained to me right..or I remember it correctly (doubtful).

heymagic Wrote:
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> The issue with "our" system is the variable
> transit time. If you have a bad stage time then
> you get a short transit. So you risk gettin it the
> ass twice, once on stage time and then again on
> road points. It encourages speeding on transits. I
> believe the Canadian system is a combo of the FIA
> and US system. Alan??

The Canadian system (the superior one, in my personal opinion, but also the trickiest) does seem to be a combination of the FIA and the system used by events outside of PRG/NW.

Personally, between the PRG/NW timing and the other US system, I prefer the PRG one, because I don't like it when you have more than one car trying to check into a control on the same minute, which is very possible with the other US system.

> If we
> want to host a national event then I believe we
> should use the same system that the visiting
> drivers will be used to.

I believe that it is likely that, as a RA National Rally, Olympus will use the other US system this year for the reason you stated.

alan

heymagic Wrote:
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> The issue with "our" system is the variable
> transit time. If you have a bad stage time then
> you get a short transit. So you risk gettin it the
> ass twice, once on stage time and then again on
> road points. It encourages speeding on transits.

The FIA systems has these drawbacks, yes.

> Beyond that , every other rally community in the
> US somehow gets by on the "other" system.

Que? The entire Atlantic Rally Cup, the six event spanning from Florida to New Hampshire, which is every NRS event on the east coast, uses Modified FIA timing (aka the Canadian System). I think about half of the west coast NRS events do.


> If we
> want to host a national event then I believe we
> should use the same system that the visiting
> drivers will be used to.

With an alternate philosophy being use the one that the majority of the competitors are used to... if the visitors are a minority maybe you wouldn't want to. Whatever makes the most people happy.

Cheers,
Anders

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Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

Anders Green Wrote:
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> heymagic Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Beyond that , every other rally community in the
> > US somehow gets by on the "other" system.
>
> Que? The entire Atlantic Rally Cup, the six event
> spanning from Florida to New Hampshire, which is
> every NRS event on the east coast, uses Modified
> FIA timing (aka the Canadian System). I think
> about half of the west coast NRS events do.

One problem that I have had with my decision to stop competing and spend my time organizing and working on rules is that I wouldn't be getting first hand experience with how other events are doing things. I have competed in a few NRS events and never encountered use of Modified FIA timing at those events, but my run with Lisa Klassen at Prescott '06 was my last NRS event.

> > If we
> > want to host a national event then I believe we
> > should use the same system that the visiting
> > drivers will be used to.
>
> With an alternate philosophy being use the one
> that the majority of the competitors are used
> to... if the visitors are a minority maybe you
> wouldn't want to. Whatever makes the most people
> happy.

My personal opinion is that most of these kind of operational elements of an event that is part of a National series should be common across the series. I don't see much point in differentiating an event through the timing system used.

alan

tipo158 Wrote:
--
> My personal opinion is that most of these kind of
> operational elements of an event that is part of a
> National series should be common across the
> series. I don't see much point in differentiating
> an event through the timing system used.
>
> alan

Sure, to an extent. But Alan you know there are some strong regional differences and very strong opinions well past the point of arrogance in some of those in some regions.
Hell maybe all the different regions.
We think we have it the best up here, California is way the fuck off in left field with their completely own set of car classes, and the Mid-west boys are, and have been for decades, of the position that they are the smartest, the fastest, the gawd-dam bestest at everything.
And everybody seems to keep a real straight face, and play in public the smiley smile, , good ol' boy front---while cussing and swearing and spewing shit that makes ME flinch in written and verbal communication when they think nobody knows.
(I have, of course , been on the recieving end of numerous raging, ranting, rampages from folks who blab about the need of "Professionalism" in their phony public and online personas, and if I had just a mild, slightly negative but mostly neutral---because they were just schmucks somewhere else---before, afterwards I have a total lack of respect for them as humans, they are equivalent to shit on a field. (Nothing special, a little bad aroma now and then when the wind is wrong, but easy to avoid)

That said,
rather than negotiate with all the strong, obstinate personalities, OR chafe under yet more ad hoc stupid mandates from slimey, two faced shitheads who don't respect anybody elsecause they know better,
WHY NOT ACCEPT LOCAL DIFFERENCES?.....
And put the otherwised likely wasted energy of arguing for uniformity to better uses like RECRUITMENT and RETENTION, REGIONAL POWER SHARING, LOBBYING for LEGITIMACY?
>
>

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
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