Jim Breazeale Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gentlemen, While this has been both entertaining
> and distressing, it does nothing to further the
> common aim of growing the sport. Robert and
> Merrilee are actually doing something for the
> sport. It would be to all our best interests to
> contribute something positve. Before this thread
> went to the dogs, there were some very good ideas
> put forth, keep them coming.
>
> I was a volunteer for nearly 5 years before I just
> couldn't take it any longer and built a car to run
> with help from several folks here. Thank You
> Robert, Dave Clark, Gene and JVL!! I had some of
> the most frustrating, exciting and frightening
> experiences of my life in the car. I still enjoy
> the sport, but from far away at the moment. I will
> work some events again in the future when we move
> closer to the action. There were some days as a
> worker that sucked and it was only the kind words
> of Thanks from the competitors and the Stage
> Captains that made up for hanging out in the cold
> rain all weekend on my nickle. As a competitor I
> made sure that everytime I saw a worker I Thanked
> them. It is the small things that make a
> difference.

Robert more than me, I started a thread and he's taken some suggestions and run with them and gotten me to go "yeah, I guess I can do that". It's hard to be motivated by one's self, but when you have someone questioning you and pushing you it makes it easier to actually get involved and want to help more. I still haven't gotten around to posting a thread at SS he wanted me to, mostly because I still haven't worked out the wording in my head. I'm slow, but eventually I'll get there. I also know that what we are hoping to accomplish would not happen in time for Oregon Trail, so I feel a little less pressure and I've been focusing some of my time on just trying to convince friends and family and anyone I come across into working OTR (which is coming up really soon).

Are they're any workers in particular we're always low on? Is there a pattern? I've never worked the "rally" side, always the service crew side, what are the basic positions? Stage captains, a couple Marshals here and there? Spectator marshals? Whats the hard to fill, and whats the easy to fill? What needs the MOST?

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Are they're any workers in particular we're always
> low on? Is there a pattern? I've never worked the
> "rally" side, always the service crew side, what
> are the basic positions? Stage captains, a couple
> Marshals here and there? Spectator marshals? Whats
> the hard to fill, and whats the easy to fill? What
> needs the MOST?
>
> Feisty Peacock?

Seems like start and finish are always the hardest to fill. People are inherantly afraid to do those jobs as they might make a mistake. Truth is it's not that hard. Electronic timing and backup logs make it pretty easy. There are ham radios at both locations and issues can be handled easily. Once in a while you get a fussy co-driver not often any more. Yelling at control workers is extremely counter productive. Spectator marshall is a bit more difficult. You have to deal with enthusiastic people, stupid or ignorant people (not the same thing) , sometimes drunk people. Best to be a little larger, older and authoritative while still being nice. Not all stages have spectator areas. Road guards are mostly easy. Block an intersection and watch for non-rally traffic. Once in a while you get a growler who wants thru no matter what. They usually are convinced when the next car comes blasting thru. Ham radios are a plus but some comm can be done with CB or FRS also.

It would be neat if Rally Anarchy could provide most of a stage crew. A team effort, make some banners and so on. Easy for the PNW as a lot of us live here, but could likely be done elsewhere also.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Are they're any workers in particular we're always
> low on? Is there a pattern? I've never worked the
> "rally" side, always the service crew side, what
> are the basic positions? Stage captains, a couple
> Marshals here and there? Spectator marshals? Whats
> the hard to fill, and whats the easy to fill? What
> needs the MOST?
>
> Feisty Peacock?


I think it may vary from location to location. I know that at Olympus we were short of people who knew how to run the stage controls, road marshal, spectator areas and it would have been helpful to have had another stage captian (that ended up being resolved when our stage was cancelled and we took over the stage that another crew would have had to move to after working their original two).

It's hard to get enough stage crew to get the new people trained on the controls. We never seem to have enough people to double up and have those who know how train those who don't. Those who don't end up working as road block only, while those of us who know how never get a break from controls, when we'd like to have a turn doing something like road block.

What if we hosted stage crew training days? Like, say, 2 weeks before a rally, you could have little satellite training areas around the hotspots of where competitors live, so one down by olympia, one up here maybe in seattle, one in everett... its ridiculous to ALWAYS go to olympia for stuff that could be made universal and then spread out.

This way, come the rally, the new peeps [should] have some what of a clue as to what they need to be doing.

you could also set up a rotation system, so if one day, you run start, the next say you run finish, then the next rally you run road marshal, then the next day of that rally you run spectator, or whatever. Or, leave spectator out of the rotation and leave them as a "unit" like pace and sweep are.

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What if we hosted stage crew training days? Like,
> say, 2 weeks before a rally, you could have little
> satellite training areas around the hotspots of
> where competitors live, so one down by olympia,
> one up here maybe in seattle, one in everett...
> its ridiculous to ALWAYS go to olympia for stuff
> that could be made universal and then spread out.
>
> This way, come the rally, the new peeps have some
> what of a clue as to what they need to be doing.
>
> you could also set up a rotation system, so if one
> day, you run start, the next say you run finish,
> then the next rally you run road marshal, then the
> next day of that rally you run spectator, or
> whatever. Or, leave spectator out of the rotation
> and leave them as a "unit" like pace and sweep
> are.
>
> Feisty Peacock?


Training is something Robert and I are trying to figure out and put in place. But it's going to take a little time. We've got a couple of ideas now that are being looked into.

And yes, rotation is exactly what most people want to be able to do when they volunteer. I know I like working different places on different days. But, I think that's only going to happen when there are enough trained people.

There are always going to be some who will want to work a specific type of post no matter what (I have friends with kids who are only interested in working as road marshals because that's the easiest way to help and still bring the little ones).

Well, people with experience in a particular job and ONLY want to work one spot could be "captains" of that spot, and then rotate the newbs there, and they can learn from the experienced peeps

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well, people with experience in a particular job
> and ONLY want to work one spot could be "captains"
> of that spot, and then rotate the newbs there, and
> they can learn from the experienced peeps
>
> Feisty Peacock?


Very true. But, that requires having enough n00bs who are a. interested in that and b. available to do it

so, before we can start having that happen, we've got to get more people recruited to help

it's almost a catch 22, people don't want to volunteer without enough variety, but without enough volunteers we can't provide variety

I'm not sure what the laws are in the US for amateur radio operators, in Canada -radio operators need to be licensed.

This can add problems for organizing volunteers, if none of them or too few are licensed.

Finding an instructor (or school) to run a course once or twice per year to get an increased number of people certified, could avert a potential for a lack of radio operators.

I'm getting my VHF operators licence this summer, albiet for a marine application.

Which leads me to wonder if a HAM operator is the same as VHF ?

Morten2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not sure what the laws are in the US for
> amateur radio operators, in Canada -radio
> operators need to be licensed.
>
> This can add problems for organizing volunteers,
> if none of them or too few are licensed.
>
> Finding an instructor (or school) to run a course
> once or twice per year to get an increased number
> of people certified, could avert a potential for a
> lack of radio operators.
>
> I'm getting my VHF operators licence this summer,
> albiet for a marine application.
>
> Which leads me to wonder if a HAM operator is the
> same as VHF ?
>
>

VHF and HAM are not the same in the US anyway. We don't need a VHF license anymore for marine use. We also don't have to license radar like in the old days, nor need a license for CB radios. Lee Chambers does a HAM class if 6 people sign up. I want to do that also. In reality the FCC needs to back off the archaic license requirement for HAM radio to the point someone could get an "event" license to help out with just a minimum knowledge of procedures. Nowadays with the internet, wireless everything most people aren't going to be putting up towers and basking in the glow of tubes trying to talk with someone in Dublin on HAM radios. Hell you can talk to someone in SriLanka or Ceylon just by dialing the Hewlitt Packard help line...

heymagic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Hell you can talk to someone in SriLanka
> or Ceylon just by dialing the Hewlitt Packard help
> line...



Thanks for the info (regarding HAM & VHF).

What was it ? 1972 that Ceylon became known as Sri Lanka ?

Heymagic said:
"It would be neat if Rally Anarchy could provide most of a stage crew. A team effort, make some banners and so on. Easy for the PNW as a lot of us live here, but could likely be done elsewhere also."
.........................................

That's the best oxymoron I've heard all month. Brings up visions of no Stage Captain and Timers drinking beer and doing what ever they want. I can see the T-Shirts now! What a hoot!

But seriously, it makes a lot of VERY GOOD SENSE. A semi-formalized stage crew with a Captain can do all it's own organizing long before any interaction with the Rallymaster is needed.

I nominate Jim Breazeale for Stage Captain!

Rich Smith


(ps: I still have a copy of Nagel's worker training manual Olympus (86?) if anyone might find it useful as a format model.)

Rich Smith Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Heymagic said:
> "It would be neat if Rally Anarchy could provide
> most of a stage crew. A team effort, make some
> banners and so on. Easy for the PNW as a lot of us
> live here, but could likely be done elsewhere
> also."
> .........................................
>
> That's the best oxymoron I've heard all month.
> Brings up visions of no Stage Captain and Timers
> drinking beer and doing what ever they want. I can
> see the T-Shirts now! What a hoot!
>
> But seriously, it makes a lot of VERY GOOD SENSE.
> A semi-formalized stage crew with a Captain can do
> all it's own organizing long before any
> interaction with the Rallymaster is needed.
>
> I nominate Jim Breazeale for Stage Captain!
>
> Rich Smith
>
>
> (ps: I still have a copy of Nagel's worker
> training manual Olympus (86?) if anyone might find
> it useful as a format model.)
>
>


Edstrom " Can I get my time please?"
Morten "Sorry they won't tell me what it is"
Edstrom " Hey you, give me my time"
Timm " I don't have time to give you your time, I'm studying"
Edstrom" Somebody give me my goddamn time'
JVL " Here's your fucking time you fucking fuck"
Edstrom "That's not my time!"
JVL " Well it's my time from 1988 and it's a great fucking time, you know it would be better on SooperBitchin suspenders though"
Edstrom " That's just bullshit, somebody get me a good time"
Rich " I saw an ad for a good time on Craigslist"
Merrilee " Hey that was my ad"
Edstrom " Hurry up you guys there is another car coming"
Dave " I'll stop it with my potato cannon"
Gene "No ya won't I put a new restrictor in the barrel"
Jay "Hey as long as you guys aren't in a big hurry can I look at your turbo, mine won't work"
Edstrom " Get away from my car and get my fucking time now"
Robert " Sir, we don't tolerate that kind of behavior in Botswana. Now move along please"

Seriously I think we could do it and people would talk about it for years....

heymagic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rich Smith Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Heymagic said:
> > "It would be neat if Rally Anarchy could
> provide
> > most of a stage crew. A team effort, make
> some
> > banners and so on. Easy for the PNW as a lot
> of us
> > live here, but could likely be done
> elsewhere
> > also."
> > .........................................
> >
> > That's the best oxymoron I've heard all
> month.
> > Brings up visions of no Stage Captain and
> Timers
> > drinking beer and doing what ever they want.
> I can
> > see the T-Shirts now! What a hoot!
> >
> > But seriously, it makes a lot of VERY GOOD
> SENSE.
> > A semi-formalized stage crew with a Captain
> can do
> > all it's own organizing long before any
> > interaction with the Rallymaster is needed.
> >
> > I nominate Jim Breazeale for Stage Captain!
> >
> > Rich Smith
> >
> >
> > (ps: I still have a copy of Nagel's worker
> > training manual Olympus (86?) if anyone might
> find
> > it useful as a format model.)
> >
> >
>
>
> Edstrom " Can I get my time please?"
> Morten "Sorry they won't tell me what it is"
> Edstrom " Hey you, give me my time"
> Timm " I don't have time to give you your time,
> I'm studying"
> Edstrom" Somebody give me my goddamn time'
> JVL " Here's your fucking time you fucking fuck"
> Edstrom "That's not my time!"
> JVL " Well it's my time from 1988 and it's a great
> fucking time, you know it would be better on
> SooperBitchin suspenders though"
> Edstrom " That's just bullshit, somebody get me a
> good time"
> Rich " I saw an ad for a good time on Craigslist"
> Merrilee " Hey that was my ad"
> Edstrom " Hurry up you guys there is another car
> coming"
> Dave " I'll stop it with my potato cannon"
> Gene "No ya won't I put a new restrictor in the
> barrel"
> Jay "Hey as long as you guys aren't in a big
> hurry can I look at your turbo, mine won't work"
> Edstrom " Get away from my car and get my fucking
> time now"
> Robert " Sir, we don't tolerate that kind of
> behavior in Botswana. Now move along please"
>
> Seriously I think we could do it and people would
> talk about it for years....

I see something with disturbing Pythonesque potentialities.
>
>

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

While I am honored that Rich would nominate me as the Rally Anarchy Stage Captain, I still live out here in the geographic middle of nowhere. I would do it in a PNW minute (slightly longer than a NY minute, we are more laid back) IF I was much closer!!!

Robert- contact Rich and see if you can either get Rich to copy the Olympus Training Manual or borrow it so you can see what it contains and how you can adapt it to modern rules.

Rich you are still one crazy guy!

---

Diamond Jim
Co-Driver in the Double Zero course opening car
Charter Member of O.U.C.H.
Organized Union of Cat Herders