Came across this picture just now.

What is rally? Two gearheads in a REAL car, going REAL fast, on REAL roads.

I dunno. Something about pictures from the "good old days" just speaks to me.

Before the lawsuits, the insurance regulations, and célèbre, this was rally.

Anyway, just passing through...

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Brian Driggs | KG7KCA | PHX, AZ | 89 Pajero
alterius non sit qui suus esse potest

We went wrong when we got the BIG MONEYand BIG SPONSORS etc.
Whose drivers could manage a few miles of stage before crashing BIG.
Nick

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Nick Leone
Former scca member

We went wrong when we let lawyers handle cases on commission and we graduated thousands of them to sue everyone six ways to Sunday.

/thread

Quote
NGTD
We went wrong when we let lawyers handle cases on commission and we graduated thousands of them to sue everyone six ways to Sunday.

/thread

This!

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-Brian

Quote
NGTD
We went wrong when we let lawyers handle cases on commission and we graduated thousands of them to sue everyone six ways to Sunday.

/thread

While i would have a hard time ever finding anything good to say about the typical lawyer, its actually closer to the situation of the typical ADVERTISER.

Advertisers, be it production companies or the ad agency itself don't go make a commercial for Ford or Chebby or Trojan rubbers and then go out and try and sell the idea to the Company.

Lawyers don't book time in court and then like freight brokers sell the time slot,.

PEOPLE hire them both..

And people hire them to do all the unethical, repellant things that they do knowing they will do anything to win, because lawyers, like clients, come from a society where most people feel so powerless and vulnerable ( told that repeatedly every advertisement that is played), and who have been so coddled, had treasures piled up on them at their merest whim, that when something happens then they are OUTRAGED and it ain't their fault ever and they're gonna make them bastards PAY!!

Righteous indignation, cultivated sense of powerlessness--a step away from victimhood ("It's not my fault I ate a half gallon of ice cream every 4 hours for years, THEY DIDN'T PUT A WARNING ON IT SAYING I COULDN'T!!!" and the message relentlessly force fed ( Yoooooouuur'e special!!!)

It's almost a perfect storm of greed, expectations of wealth ("probably ill gotten",
a perception of a crooked economic system and sloth= sue the bastids...



I make this huge apology for the "trade' of lawyering because as we've seen the rise of Neo-conservatism and it's generous borrowing of all the old tricks of the Neo-Fascists, and the old original Fascists with their tactics of screaming a lie often enough and loud enough coupled with their RELENTLESS GLORIFICATION of MILITARY antics results in a false picture of the role of the military in our history ---changing just in my lifetime.........

The only thing standing between us, every one of us, including silly, misguided, and ignorant people who imagine they're all corn-servative, and Libba-farian, and "nobody ever did a thing for me"
and poverty of the sort seen in Philippines or Peru or India....
has been generations of brave fuckin lawyers countering in court the will of other lawyers representing huge multinational corporations and those corporate owners/lackies/hangers on..
They're the reason you have a vote.
They're the reason there was schools to teach everybody some basics for free.
They're the reason the water is clean
They're the reason there's no lead in the solder in the "tin can"
They're the reason you can stand on a corner with more than 3 people and thumb your nose.
They're the reason cops think twice before they interrogate you 36 hours straight to force confessions.

Et cetera.

Jeeeebus haitch Krist, I must be getting old that I'd say "Wellllllllllllllll...........let's think (before we machine gun every gawd damn lawyer)...."

JV, I think you've hit on the basic truth here. The profession of law is a good thing. It gets perverted by corporate and individual greed, and by the entitlment society that we seem to be becoming.
I respect your position as a liberal. Although I'm a fiscal conservative, and I believe in a strong military, I don't mind spears thrown at conservatives, as long as the person throwing spears doesn't mind recieving a few. I also believe in many liberal positions (I'm a vegan partly due to the terrible animal cruelty that goes on in modern agriculture.. Hanity wouldn't approve). I believe you're right that a Big Government, in the pockets of Big Corporations, controlling the flow of information to the people, and a population that doesn't care, is a recipe for disaster. We need to understand that big business buys politicians.. BUT POLITICIANS BUY OUR VOTES THROUGH ENTITLEMENTS. It confounds me how anyone can truely believe that a big government running everything, and handing out entitlments can be a good thing for the people! The more entitlments we vote for the more power we cede to dirty politicians (on either side of the aisle), and the less motivation we have for getting off our duff and taking responsibility for our selves. Out of work and too 'proud' to work at McDonalds? No problem, we'll take care of you (I personally know people out of work and not even looking because the unemployment benefits keep getting extended)! Not living healthy? No problem, we'll take care of you! I know lots of people are truely hurting these days, but how many of them gave up the smokes to save money? How many keep the cable tv? Ever taken a critical look at someone elses grocery cart? Even if they're broke as a joke it's usually full of trash. The entitlement mindset ends when people truely take responsibility for their actions and their way of life. Just because Republican polititians vote for entitlments doesn't make it a conservative position. We can't trust big corporations or big financial institutions, and we can't trust politicians either. It's utopia when we have a government full of politicians who only have the best interests of the people and nation in mind. Making matters worse, a significant part of the general population would be very happy if they didn't have to work for anything in their entire lives. Some people are happy living as parasites. The more socially acceptable that becomes the more people live that way. We don't live in utopia and never will.
In my mind a lot of things will have to change before this trend reverses direction. Really a large scale collapse. The 'community' would have to come back.. a place where we take personal responsibility, but also help neighbors in times of their need, and depend on them in times of our own need. A place where parents take responsibility for the education of their children instead of relying on school programs to teach all those touchy subjects and to baby sit our kids all day. A place where one parent stays at home (it's truely a full time job). A place where you drive your rally car, and the land owners don't have to worry about a lawsuit if you wreck... because you take personal responsibility for your actions and the possible consequenses to your health!

There are a buttload of ambulance chasers in the legal world as there are large numbers of good attorneys. The shithead who thought Lindsay Lohan had a case for suing ETrade over the milkaholic commercial is a good example of an AC. http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/lohan_such_baby_jVdQWABj9z0MgXzCv1Nh1O

Attorneys can protect us from many dangers just like Mom, cops and soldiers. They can be just as bad as a druken mom working a truck stop also. Don't judge all by the actions of a few.

Back in the good old days rally cars averaged in the 30mph range on nationals. The power and torque output nowadays is probably 2.5 times greater on the regional level. Tires are seriously better. JVLs budget suspension eclipses anything available in the 70's and most of the 80's. Roads have gotten smoother due to construction methods and safety. I don't know if I had more fun than the current crop of competitors but $30 BFGs, $20 KYBs, wrecking yard bucket seats, Snell 75 helmets and Proban coveralls just din't seem expensive then. JVL, DaveClark, Sean T and many of us fought great battles on small budgets with priceless memories. I'm glad I was there as it will never be repeated.

things change. that's life. deal with it.

It all stems from psychology, that pseudo-science of bullshit interpretation of how people MIGHT think or feel or feel like thinking, or think to feel. Not only advertisers' use of it, but also governmental and institutional use of it. We are being slowly and subtly (and sometimes not so subtly) conditioned and programmed. It's the worlds biggest experiment using human test subjects.

Of course, the VERY effective vehicle of psychology is maintained by the inordinate craving of lack of personal responsibility for anything.

it's like the gateway drug of World Domination, and They (capital "T" have made use of it, and are still making use of it, and I think Their plan is working....

Sometimes, I think that some pretty outlandish and crazy "conspiracy theories" might not really be theories.

--sarge

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---** To be in compliance with the Anarchy **---
Jorden R. Kleier
Baraboo, Wisconsin, USA
1990 Mazdog Protege 4WD
1973

During some recent deep thoughts, I came up with a theory that just as communism fails due to the underlying greed of man, capitalism too fails due to the underlying greed of man. It just takes longer and manifests itself in a much different way. The fact that so much wealth is tied up and given to people that don't actually produce anything and that percentage of people keeps growing will be the downfall. Or something like that.

Interesting thought Grant... but do they really fail for such different reasons?

I am feeling a little philosophical so I will take a few stabs at this subject.

I know it is all the vogue to bash big companies but I think that is miss-directed energy. Companies are run by people and most big companies are rather transparent because they are required to be. Companies are not evil or good the people that run them are evil or good just like all other people. Companies typically have one reason to exist, to provide some benefit for the owners. The owners (people) are the ones that should do good or bad with the wealth they receive from the company.

Companies not supported by the government tend to do a good job at providing a good or service that a lot of people want, else they go away on their own.

Wealth is not a fixed thing, having a lot of wealthy people being unproductive is not a drag on the rest of the people. Very few wealthy people do not do things with their money. The things the wealthy do tend to create jobs for less wealthy people. I myself was a yacht captain for several years, paid by a wealthy dude to sail.

Government is a monopoly.

Average people look for an edge and since most of us are average we did not wish to race in equal cars or on equal tires etc. The best drivers would likely rather show their stuff on equal terms but we the average out voted them looking for an edge forgetting this spawns an un-winnable arms race to better and better stuff.

We remember the past better then it really was. Grooving $30 BFG's was hard smelly work!

Quote
derek
Wealth is not a fixed thing, having a lot of wealthy people being unproductive is not a drag on the rest of the people. Very few wealthy people do not do things with their money.

Yup. I'd love if we had another 200 rally drivers in this country with $$,$$$,$$$ bank accounts.

Quote

we the average out voted them looking for an edge forgetting this spawns an un-winnable arms race to better and better stuff.

Yup. We need to push the reset button.

Anders

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Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

Derek you posted what I was thinkin, only more betterer than I was gonna

I agree Derek. When Gov gets involved in business it screws up/takes out of the loop the whole 'supply vs demand' part of it. My problem with big business is that they have alot of power and very little transparency. They take liberties with our health, and with the environment, and with our economy that few citizens would be happy about if they knew. Of course, it's not the company, it's the greedy individuals with few ethics that ruin it for everyone!