Doo Wops 2011

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john vanlandingspam
Is that something enough to get me any credibility in your eyes?

The thing is John, credibility is neither finite nor all encompassing it is also not universally recognised.

We can all have credibility, if we deserve it, it isn't a situation where my having credibility somehow diminishes yours.

Beyond that, I don't even remotely pretend to have credibility in fabrication or car building. I have ideas on what should be done and I have a good handle on the rules and what is allowed but I wouldn't dare expect to be considered an authority on HOW to put things together. On the other hand, I have built up credibility - amongst those who know me - in a few areas where I have demonstrable experience and proficiency.

In your case, you have credibility - although a slightly clouded reputation - when it comes to fabrication, suspension design, car preparation and rally competition.
I don't know how many sanctioned rally events you've put on and without knowing you have organised a few I can't give you credibility in that area. Your credibility as a fabricator/competitor does NOT transfer over.

'Been there, done that' builds credibility for sure. But just like good trophies, that credibility tarnishes with age.

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john vanlandingspam
And when somebody called me up and asked to do some scrutineering at Doo-Wops, didn't i go do that?
I recall i said "Thanks for reaching out"

I can't remember the last time I waited for a personal invitation to volunteer at an event. EVERY event needs help - it isn't rocket science - and I can't imagine not volunteering at an event, in some capacity, that is less than 200km from my doorstep. I even help out at events that I am competing in ... not to get a competitive advantage but to help make sure the events happen and run smoothly. (Actually I do recall the last time I was approached to help out - it was to review the recce schedule for Mt. Hood a few years ago)

Bringing this SLIGHTLY back on track. Tracy, if you need help with building a recce schedule - or even just a review of what you have - send it my way.

With personal dollars on the line, it is important to build an event that will draw the most competitors. You are building a product that needs to find a successful market. EVERYONE I talk to says they wouldn't enter any event that isn't 2 pass recce. EVERYONE I talk to prefers one day recce, one day rally and also prefers one long day of competition over two short days ... but when you consider who I talk to neither of those positions is a surprise and the information is also not horribly relevant. Add in the fact that I am known to be a strong proponent of Recce and pace notes, some people might skew their discussion to my position. (John: Take note of this last point - I suspect this happens a lot when people talk with you)

I will say that I would want to see a full night between recce and racing when there is two pass recce, for fairly obvious reasons. (although if the unique road distance is short enough, I can deal with a shorter break)

There is a chance I might be coming out to do DooWops this year. That chance is infinitely higher if it is a recce event. I can say with certainty that you would draw more teams out of Canada for a recce event than a blind event. I would also think that the number of teams that would come from Canada in either case wouldn't be significant enough to sway your plans. Build the event that your core 'active' competitors will attend.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/2010 09:55AM by Morison.

John,

I am "playing at" two things:

1. If you are not willing or able to help the organizers don't say anything. Talk is cheap.

2. Don't be a jerk with the organizers that give competitors a reason to be your customers. The volunteer organizers have full time jobs that allow them to put on rallies for free. They are doing every one a big favor.

---

Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.

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Rallymech

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John,

I am "playing at" two things:

1. If you are not willing or able to help the organizers don't say anything. Talk is cheap.

I saw this and I thought a saw a Poll on SS:

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The final schedule for DooWop 2011 is still pending. Recce is being considered but not finalized. 1 day versus 2, again... also being considered.

Still working on roads before we can confirm all details.

And said simply that everybody I talked to said 2 day No recce.

And foolishly made a neutral comment on alternate roads, a NEUTRAL Comment...


What a stupid thing to do on a discussion forum, what the fuck was i thinking?
I guess i am a total idiot, I forgot that anything that ends with a question mark is an underhanded violent rant...

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2. Don't be a jerk with the organizers that give competitors a reason to be your customers. The volunteer organizers have full time jobs that allow them to put on rallies for free. They are doing every one a big favor.

I'm sorry, even if I can't recall, it was over the last few days, I'll try not to ever have a comment on anything any organiser or offical ever does or says since obviously any comment constitutes being a jerk.
Your buddy Morison can wade in, change my text to "I am a tool" and since he is, among other things sometimes around rallies, that must be perfectly OK, because "it's funny".

Hey Robert, evert think that without some bunch of guys making stuff affordable and giving their time and experience to a lotta guys that the Organisers would NOT have a lot of REPEAT customers/entrants?
It'll be pretty small events if its only a few guys who can afford approach this sport with the attitude to go to some shop and accept it when they say "leave your checkbook, you won't be needing that again".

We all do what we can, one position is not superior to or more indispensable that the other, but everybody is replaceable, everybody can and should be cycled through various positions ----except some guys get juicy plums like doing Pace or Zero Car and they glom onto it and will never consider , never CONCEIVE of relinquishing their grasp on that---.

Makes it hard to get involved--you know full well what I'm talking about locally.

Everybody down to whoever we can drag into driving the service truck is just as important as the next---if we care about more than one event.
Everything is just depending on from what point of view your looking.


Unless of course peoples' minds are already made up.

Well without a bunch of guys making affordable suspension, you would probably end up with people like Cody Crane- Fast on stock suspension, or not. Or people on more expensive suspension, going fast, or not.

I've been working on staying out of all this, but what is the point of this statement?

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Dazed_Driver
Well without a bunch of guys making affordable suspension, you would probably end up with people like Cody Crane- Fast on stock suspension, or not. Or people on more expensive suspension, going fast, or not.

And where are the bunch of guys making affordable suspension? I have only found one....he's kinda spicy and a little salty, but what do you expect?

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alkun
And where are the bunch of guys making affordable suspension? I have only found one....he's kinda spicy and a little salty, but what do you expect?

Al it seems reasonable to expect that such a person would not have so many Eff-Yous, suggestions that someone on the board kill himself ect ect. We all know damned good and well that this individual would not ever speak that way in person.

My car has Sellholm's suspension. Money well spent.

Just to keep the whole thing going....Barrett at All Wheels Driven makes Bilstein suspension also.

While JV has seemingly dedicated his life to rally, it is largely self serving. He is making a profit. Most of the dasterdly organizers just hope to break even on an event and all of the volunteers visit the red zone.
Financial business details, who loaned who money etc, should be kept out of forums and this discussion.

While everyone gets to have an opinion, no one who is not actually on stage should ever call out an organizer over the roads they use or demand details of an event. They certainly shouldn't lump Tracey Manspeaker in with the likes of Forespring. For the record we may have lost Traceys participation on this forum...how can that be a positive move?

This forum too often turns into a big infomercial for JVAB. Many others have experience and info to share. Keith is a very knowledgable international co-driver and organizer. Unfortunately he has a sense of humor but JVL had decided if Keith makes a funny it is a horrid personal attack. Timm, who doesn't have a lot of rally experience, was ok until he paid for his stuff from John and now is a troll like Morrison. Timm does needle JV but only in retaliation for JVs over the top behavior.

I'll repeat...the attacks and bad language need to stop...this damages the sport way more than painting a Subaru blue.

It's not about credibilty, dedication or knowledge. It's about civility, respect and , most of all, manners.

I can't even fucking believe the fucking shit I see on this fucking board. What a fucking drag to read this crap in the fucking morning before the first fucking cup of coffee. Unfucking believable.


So everyone ...have a HAPPY THANKSGIVING...you fucking fucks.

Speaking of turkeys...be sure to watch the punkin chunkin on Discovery channel today.

and why hasn't Dave Clark (the greater) made one of these??

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JohnLane

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alkun
And where are the bunch of guys making affordable suspension? I have only found one....he's kinda spicy and a little salty, but what do you expect?

Al it seems reasonable to expect that such a person would not have so many Eff-Yous, suggestions that someone on the board kill himself ect ect. We all know damned good and well that this individual would not ever speak that way in person.

My car has Sellholm's suspension. Money well spent.

Oh I know. I'm planning on someday winning all your Sellholm stuff from you in a poker game or a duel or somthing.

Happy Thanksgiving, all you sensitive sasquatches

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alkun

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JohnLane

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alkun
And where are the bunch of guys making affordable suspension? I have only found one....he's kinda spicy and a little salty, but what do you expect?

Al it seems reasonable to expect that such a person would not have so many Eff-Yous, suggestions that someone on the board kill himself ect ect. We all know damned good and well that this individual would not ever speak that way in person.

My car has Sellholm's suspension. Money well spent.

Oh I know. I'm planning on someday winning all your Sellholm stuff from you in a poker game or a duel or somthing.

Happy Thanksgiving, all you sensitive sasquatches

You could go swipe the stuff..as often as he gets the car on stage he likely wouldn't notice it was gone for a couple years.

The world record holding trebuchet (2,034 feet, retired 2009) lives about 5 miles from me.





http://www.yankeesiege.com/

They also have a mace ball which might be useful for the increasing troll problem on this site.




Antagonizers, don't antagonize JV. JV, ignore the antagonizers and do what you do best, build stuff.

In the words of renowned psychologist Dr. Denis Leary, "Shut the fuck up! Next!"

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heymagic
You could go swipe the stuff..as often as he gets the car on stage he likely wouldn't notice it was gone for a couple years.

She sleeps in the shop Gene. You are going to make me pay you a visit. Life gets in the way! The Volvo needs to be out scaring + applying welts to spectators.

Read this, and then comment...

http://www.sharetrails.org/uploads/11_19_10_USFS_Letter.pdf

Could be a boon for the PNW Rally scene...

Thanks...

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SteveL
This is the point in the killing spree when you really should turn the gun on yourself