Duratec bolts up to a t5? That would be my guess.

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GuinnessFox
Ok, so why the duratec motor? Why not the 6 speed SVT with turbo? The zx3 is... lacking compared to the svt from factory. My friend from the ford dealer told me to get an svt, keep it fwd and use ford racing parts from the dealer.

your plan would be fine if you want to keep it FWD.

william is saying to buy the cheapest focus you can find so you can rip everything out and make it a modern RWD ford. if you arent going to keep it FWD for long the SVT stuff and the 6spd FWD box will be a waste of money.

however, if you want it to be FWD for a while and have some fun with it that way perhaps the SVT route would be good because you can sell that stuff off later.

duratec will be cheaper and easier to mate to the T5 when you rotate the engine 90 degrees in the engine bay.

whoever does this swap is going to want to keep a very detailed parts number list and notes on what was done and how to remove and replace everything. and make copies, lots and lots of copies.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2011 10:08AM by Greg Donovan.

So I'm curious here...not trying to start anything either...William do you have any actual rally experience? Or any car bulding experience? The Focus swap is a pretty big undertaking, will result in pretty small production runs. I realize you have some nice welding/jig talent but vehicle dynamics design talents? You're somewhat duplicating the efforts of the hugely funded factory GpB efforts but with RWD and no resources. I see a lot of work and expense and no proof the car will be reliable or handle well. Look how long it took to get the Evo10 competitive or how poorly the BL Metro rally car faired. Vermont Sports Car took a while to get the new Sube going a couple years ago and I've seen what they finally developed for Higgins. That was huge money, experience and efforts.

I don't doubt you can build a RWD Focus, many others have done similar efforts, but will it be worth the effort? Will it make an average driver able to compete with Cody in a beater CRX? Will it be reliable or will one of the hand built components fail and send it off a cliff 3 miles in? Will the owners be able to get spares in the parking lot or wrecking yard on a weekend or will they need a semi and a traveling warehouse? Will the car be a world beater or a curiosity? Is this a valid path for a newb to rally? Would a newb be better served with a traditional car that has massive support and knowledge?

I apologize if this appears to be an attack, it is not, just some questions I have that I think should be discussed. Please don't construe it as anything other than that.

Ok guys. Serious question. Neighbor has a 1985 Fox stang fastback with 63 on the clock, automatic with a little fender damage for sale for 1000. Has the whole 9 yards on it. Should I jump on it? Needs a battery and starter. Will post pictures around 7pm central. Has an elder carb on it. New tires, new rims, new wires and sparks. Just needs some body love. My ford guy said jump on it, offer 1k cash. Go for it? 5.0 engine in it.

Guys, pics; www.nzmustang.com/buysell/walters2.jpg This is that is looks like. Get it for 1k?

Patrick,

Just my two cents worth, but I would say no to the Mustang. If you are going to build, build something with more potential.

Gene,

Valid questions. I am surprised that it has taken so long for someone to bring these concerns up. William will have to jump in here and speak for himself, but I would like to offer my own observations. Looks can be deceiving. William is young, drinks too much caffeinated sugary stuff and has a tendency toward flat brim hats! He is also intelligent, creative and a good listener. Most importantly he is committed. William has been able to provide good answers to all of my questions so far. The Focus conversion will inevitably run into some problems but I am confident that William will be able to find good solutions.

I have been pushing William to get some formal driving instruction. I think that it will be invaluable for him to be able to better understand what his customers are telling him. William has also talked about getting an experienced driver to test his car and give feedback. Building a car is one thing, developing that car is another.

As I see it, Williams big problem is that he needs to either find a launch customer or self finance this build. From what I can see his other product lines are producing cash flow. I can understand if he is cautious about taking such a big risk.

---

Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.

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GuinnessFox
My friend from the ford dealer told me to get an svt, keep it fwd and use ford racing parts from the dealer.

Your friend from the dealer would not have a job if he didn't say that.

Personally, there are a few cars I would ever consider building. A Focus is not one of them.
Merkur XR4ti, Volvo 240, BMW E36 Compact (318ti), and a Honda Civic SI. There's a few others that I'd like to build and rally, like a Toyota Starlet, but that don't really make a lot of sense to build.

Hey guys,

I am guiness' ford friend.

I raced a striped down 2003 ford focus svt. It was front wheel drive with no conversion. Towards the end of its life the car gained a Jackson racing supercharger. The car performed fine. I have no problem with civics or audi or bmw. they are all great cars. I prefer Ford over all. Now to say that i do not know what I'm talking about is kind of an insult. I don't truly consider building a Focus. An SVT Euro has what you need of the bat for a beginner, not much addition needed. For future builds once the learning stage is over, maybe an audi or a beamer. Also i do not work for ford anymore. Didn't like the car business, just like the cars.

My Favorite car i ever owned was a 89 rx7 twin turbo. it was convertible so unfortunately it didn't do too much legal racing. There was a roll cage but it would not have been smart to run it.

As far as the mustang goes, it is a steal. Needs a bit of body work but the frame is solid. It is an auto so a shift kit conversion is a must. 5.0 with edel intake and what appears to be an aftermarket performance exhaust. Haven't had a chance to crawl under and look. In our area i have seen many of these cars for 2 to 3k in much worse shape. 63k original miles and its actually and 84.

Please forgive my ADD post and the horriable spelling



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2011 12:44PM by daddymonk.

Quote
Greg Donovan

Quote
GuinnessFox
Ok, so why the duratec motor? Why not the 6 speed SVT with turbo? The zx3 is... lacking compared to the svt from factory. My friend from the ford dealer told me to get an svt, keep it fwd and use ford racing parts from the dealer.

your plan would be fine if you want to keep it FWD.

william is saying to buy the cheapest focus you can find so you can rip everything out and make it a modern RWD ford. if you arent going to keep it FWD for long the SVT stuff and the 6spd FWD box will be a waste of money.

If Ford would just bring the Damn RS to the states we wouldn't have to do any of that!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2011 12:45PM by daddymonk.

Welcome aboard John! What type of racing did you do?

---

Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.

Welcome!
Why don't you two build a Focus for rallying together?
Nemadji Trails is two events in one day. Take turns driving/codriving.
Do the same for Ojibwe and Rally Minnesota. Maybe get LSPR in there as well.
Two people means the costs are cut in half! Makes it much easier!
Once the car is done and running start prepping the spare shell. It can be a car to swap everything over to if you wreck the first one, or eventually you can build two identical cars so you can both race together.

Quote
GuinnessFox
Guys, pics; www.nzmustang.com/buysell/walters2.jpg This is that is looks like. Get it for 1k?

looks like it has glass t-tops. if so you should pass, you cant rally it with glass so you would need to put a new fixed roof on. that can be a big pain in the ass. i am not even sure you can rallyx with a glass targa top.

seriously get out to some rallycrosses. there is one just north of the twin cities next weekend on the 25th in pine city.

http://www.scca-lol.org/rally/rallyx/schedule.php

if you havent allready go talk to mark utecht. he should be there.

on the roads around MN a mustang will work just fine. we dont have the nasty rough stuff like out west or the huge rocks like out east. our roads are a lot like the stuff you see in the WRC finland rounds only with a bit more sand than grave in the road surface.


at the Nemadji events you could even get by without a odometer and you wont need lights. so you can save some costs that way. you could also even get by without an intercom since the road is run twice.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2011 02:06PM by Greg Donovan.

I used to to a bit of dirt track. Nothing serious. I had dreams of pro one day. There was a group that i would mess around with out of Moorhead/Fargo area. Lot of flat up there until you get to the lakes. Greg you know this, Your from Fargo. The places we went were out by Ottertail lake. I acctually sold cars at DL ford chystler dodge for a while. great stuff. Corwin owned em back then and i had to get out....

If you head down to fergus falls and know the right people there are some good spots out there as well.

A nother focus would be great, mine unfortuantly bit the dust. Got an eye on this mustang though...see what happens. It does not have glass tops. That mustang was just a reference picture. This one is full top.

I think i talked to mark before...name sounds really familiar.

Quote
daddymonk
Now to say that i do not know what I'm talking about is kind of an insult.

i dont think anyone said that. grant just doesnt think a focus is a great starter. i dont either, but that is mainly due to the high cost of the shell.

once you buy a shell the costs of prepping a car to get it stage ready are pretty fixed regardless of make or model.

that being said, once you try to make a car competitve then things can get really expensive really fast and then you need to be very thoughtfull about car choice.

you want cheap awd go with a open light non turbo all wheel drive impreza or 90-94 legacy.

you want cheap rwd go with a mustang or a volvo.

if you want mustang try to find a notch back. NO TARGA ROOF!

granted the volvo is going to be tough to find rust free around here so you may have to travel. hell anything is going to be rusty. which brings me up to the bmw, they are newer, rwd and can be found cheap and often times are owned by older people as they are seen as a premium brand are less abused. dont worry about the motor or trim level buy the least rusty one you can find.

you want more expensive rwd go with a merkur xr4ti and turbo.

however, be aware that you cant run a turbo car as a rookie in rally america and since they are the only game in town in MN you are sort of stuck in that front.

you want FWD? try out a focus they have worked. but i would lean towards a civic myself. can be found cheap and they have a huge aftermarket.

Quote
daddymonk
I used to to a bit of dirt track. Nothing serious. I had dreams of pro one day. There was a group that i would mess around with out of Moorhead/Fargo area. Lot of flat up there until you get to the lakes. Greg you know this, Your from Fargo. The places we went were out by Ottertail lake. I acctually sold cars at DL ford chystler dodge for a while. great stuff. Corwin owned em back then and i had to get out....

If you head down to fergus falls and know the right people there are some good spots out there as well.

A nother focus would be great, mine unfortuantly bit the dust. Got an eye on this mustang though...see what happens. It does not have glass tops. That mustang was just a reference picture. This one is full top.

I think i talked to mark before...name sounds really familiar.

utecht in action:




are the places you went to able to have a official SCCA rallycross? need to make at least 1/3 to 1/2 mile long course.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2011 02:20PM by Greg Donovan.