I voted for the Volvo 240. Now that I'm back in Sleazattle, I'm actually starting to look at picking up a 2-door 240/242. Maybe turn it into a rallycross car/TSD car/pirate-themed winter beater. Aaargh!

What is the "low tech 240" equation again? would the 91 240 DL that I had in high school be too high tech?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2011 10:49AM by KTurner.

Quote
KTurner
What is the "low tech 240" equation again? would the 91 240 DL that I had in high school be too high tech?

240 Volvo 1975-1992 shell
....2 round headlights are the nicest looking--and 7" round H4 are good loghts

.....2.3 B23 (up to about 84---forged steel crank, diesel escapee rods) or B230 (89 block or later

Bosch LH2.2 management (simple)

If n.a. Mill the hell out of the head---060" or 1,5mm, add 38mm exhaust valve from Knox Motorsort in Richmond, VA~~$18 ea, and get some stupid lumpity lump cam typ "KG8"

Some sort of headers and a 2.5" exhaust

IF keeping stock box, 4.1 axle. If opting for GM V8 Borg-Warner T5, 4.3 or 4.56

Suspenders.

Go.

If turbo: 4x4 Cossie turbo on 90+ manifold, 3" exhaust from turbo back

Same T5
4.1 or 4.3

Easy upgrade for unbreakable ring gear and diff is Toyota pick-up, many which came with 4,3 or 4,56:1 stock, mod half-shafts, weld caliper adapters,
add 4 link (I use 28" and add turrets ala Group4 everything for 9" travel shocks, easy weld in deal.

diddle fuel requirements as needed.

T5 boxes can be found with moderate searching for $50-350, pre modded belhousing available from JVAB, transforms car from a fast truck to a near ideal turbo car. Crossmembers and trans mount, too.

Upgrade as opportunity and wallet allows.

Just as an example let's just look at gearbox ad final drive.

The Misterbitchy Evo was forever everywhere else in the world the standard of the GpN class. So dominant that the typical ratio of all sorts of Evobitchis to all sorts of Sub-a-rats was about 30 Mistu to 1 Subie.

No considering the "edge of distruction design" of the lightweight block and crank and rods in the Subie, BOTH Subie EJ20 and Misterbitchi 4G62 both make good power and good torque, though as a restricted engine, the 85mm bore of the misterbitchy means it'll tolerate safely more static compression than a 92mm Subie.

So what makes them go so good--since a 2300 Volvo 8v or Ford for that matter, can make just as much if not more Beee haitch Peees and Foot/Lebs?

Gears and final drive.
Look at this:


And:
This is out of my '04 manual;
Transaxle gear ratio;
1st 2.928
2nd 1.950
3rd 1.407
4th 1.031
5th 0.720

Final reduction ratio (Differential gear ratio) 4.529
OrGear ratios / Max speed@7000RPM:
(4.875 | 4.529 final drive ratio)
1st:2.785 / 60.93 | ......65.59km/h
2nd:1.950 / 87.03 | .......93.67km/h
3rd:1.444 / 117.52 | .......126.5km/h
4th:1.096 / 154.84 | ........166.67km/h
5th:0.825 / 205.7 | ...........221.42km/h
R:3.416

Or
Final drive ratio: choice between 4.529,
Gear ratios / Max speed@7000RPM:
1st:2.785 / ............66.49km/h
2nd:1.950 / ...........94.95km/h
3rd:1.407 / ..........128.23km/h
4th:1.031 / ..........168.94
5th:0.761 / ..........224.44
R:3.416

SUbaru thru the ages:

(2001 Europe)
All wheel drive. Center and rear viscous coupler.

Epicyclical center differential with 50/50 F/R torque distribution. Five speed fully synchronized gear box.

Gear ratios:
1:3.45:1 ..........58 Km/h
2:1.95:1 .........102 Km/h
3:1.37:1 ........146 Km/h
4:0.97:1 .........205Km/h
5:0.74:1 .........234 Km/h

Final drive ratio:
3.9:1

Or (some Japan spec)
Gear ratios:
1: 3.083:1 ....66 km/h.
2: 2.062:1 .....99 km/h
3: 1.545:1 ....132 km/h
4: 1.151:1 ....178 km/h
5: 0.825:1 .....248 km/h

Final drive ratio:
4.44:1

Or:

2.916 / 2.090 / 1.555 / 1.176 / 0.900 - GC8 Group N 5 Gear Subaru 5MT Dog Kit

Nice stuff all that--and cost millions--or may as well.
Now the Borg-Warner V8 T5:

I.....2.95
II....1.93
III...1.33
IV....1.0
V.....0.73

Pretty gawddam close, so close 1-4 that it is unimportant the difference.
So while by no means close in any normal sense of the word, these ratios are far closer than 99% of the gearsets in cars since the HP wars of the late 60s.

Cost for gearkit new: $380

Core box: whatever you find a core for so $0-75

Those cars all had final drives from 4.27-4.87, but clustered around 4.4
(and cars like All-Trac were in there, too at 4.28)

Toyota 8" final drive, commonly 4.1, 4.3 or 4.37 or 4.56 cost used from $10-30 and NEW for $127-175 depending. I got a 4.1 for $10

I've found a couple of decent daily drive quality 240 turbos for $800 for one of the boys here Brian Cary.Ali Kunkanenen was given a dead 82 240 turbo and had it going in an afternoon.

So for mere fractions of the cost of an Evo, we can have a car that with minimal outlays can have the critical gearbox and final drives effectively the same, and little work in the motor, power similar. (And a little is all that's needeed in a traction limited 2wd car: 200-220bhp/ 250-300 ft/lb is plenty.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

looking at those numbers, I feel a little better about my gears with 4.11:1

At 7k rpm (realistically 6500 but for comparisons sake) Tire guestimated at 25" tall
gear MPH Ratio
1 35 3.6
2 60 2.125
3 87 1.458
4 118 1.071
5 153 .829

How did I do?

cool thanks. shouldn't have sold the cossie housing I had on my saab then.

Well it seems a nice blue Xratty was MAYBE just scooped by somebody in Nude Hampster.

Andrew............come on now, fess up. Was it you again?

Want assuage you sin of glottony?
There's a blue 240 in Jaffrey a mere 20 miles from ya that I'm digging up the details on....and thunk that maybe you could trundle on over and have a peek and see if its worthy of slamming into a dirt bank after driving thru a ditch.

Wanna? Canya?

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Yeah, I may have stolen a running blue 87 from Ray Covino...Brett and I are going to make a LeMons car out of it, since it seems to fit our level of commitment and funding. That one over in Chester is also tempting, but I really should get my MasterCard paid off first...

A 240 in Jaffrey, you say? Yeah, I could probably be persuaded to go look it over. Haven't really looked at many of those...any usual suspect areas to poke at for rust? Other than that I can assume you don't really care as long as it starts and moves under its own power.

Quote
fiasco
Yeah, I may have stolen a running blue 87 from Ray Covino...Brett and I are going to make a LeMons car out of it, since it seems to fit our level of commitment and funding. That one over in Chester is also tempting, but I really should get my MasterCard paid off first...

A 240 in Jaffrey, you say? Yeah, I could probably be persuaded to go look it over. Haven't really looked at many of those...any usual suspect areas to poke at for rust? Other than that I can assume you don't really care as long as it starts and moves under its own power.

I'm confuse . Didya say tyou got a red one, and now a blue one?
How many Lemons cars you need?
And what's this other one?
Come on this guy has 10g saved and wants to build a car.
Why not an Xratty if we could find a reasonable one.

The Volvo suffer right where passenger's feet go, and in the spare tire well aka buttcheeks.

Mainly if the car runs and blinkers blink (then they don't, then they do, then they don't, then they work again....) the steering steers etc

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

OH baby:


Under $700
Maybe under $500

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

So, when you put a quick rack or whatever in a 240, does the steering travel get shortened too or do you keep it all?

Damn things have the turning radius of a bicycle.

OK, here's where I am:

Sold 28,512 mile white 85 XR4 to Rex Karrs.

Have placed deposit on and plan to pick up Ray's blue 87 XR4 to make into a LeMons car. Of course the moment the news of me putting a deposit on that Jon Howard reminded me of his red 89...and you popped up wanting an XR4 for this guy in Connect-a-dot. Since the red 89 is a no-sunroof car, and he has a moderately sized parts stash (some of it my old stuff I sold him 11 years ago), I went and took a look.













It's been parked in one spot in the grass for five years, with predictable results to the rocker panels. Unfortunately, I got there after dark, I had a kid asleep in the car, and it was wet, so getting under the car wasn't going to happen. It has some 16" wheels on it with some Yokohama rubber that would be nice if wasn't flat spotted for five years. No battery, so couldn't hear it run. Heater core leaked, so it was bypassed. Got that funky grill/light setup on it. I know there's some value there with some of the parts and the non-holy roof, but I can't picture it being worth much more than Ray's car. Really need to get it up in the air to figure that out.

I'm kinda caught up in that LeMons thing, since it's kind of the closest thing to FolksRace we have.

The Volvo looks familiar, and I think in one of the pictures it's parked in Greenfield, which is where John's green 96 lived for a year or so.

Well our Perma-lurker Mark Hille is signed up now, say hi doooood!
Seen the cars here?

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Well, this merkur looks better than the two volvos I looked at this week. Who is selling it, Jon Howard? I'm interested. How much of a pain in the ass is the de-turboing though? It has to be group 2able.

Yeah, Jon Howard...hold on and I'll PM you an email address!

Not too bad, go non Turbo, up the comp ratio ect, or just drop in a ranger motor, maybe a duratech....

They circle track the 2.3 with great results, 200+hp NA I guess pretty easy. Lots of support.

Great car, well balanced, easy to drive, easy to build and get on stage.