RA is just trying to go green this year ( higher sanction fees, less expenditure ) . Besides those internet video just encourage young people to behave poorly . Here..this is better anyway , just pretend there is snow .

I'd have liked to do a pre rally/day1/day2 video myself, but Mary and I pretty much wear every single hat of the "team" because we are the team.

The more I start looking at results from the old MaxAttack combiner, then when people told me Saturday that Sno*Attack was regional only I realized we pretty much had the $1000 in the bag as long as we kept it on the road and I was pushing to reel in national guys...

Probably funniest experience, was catching the car ahead of us on the first stage... while we had a flat ourselves!

Quote
Morison
The wheels have a quick release plate that keeps snow from being packed into the lug nuts. I saw the same thing on most of teh top cars in Sweden last year.

I actually looked into this for my BRAID wheels. Helps too for gravel to keep the mud off the studs.

Quote
john vanlandingham

Quote
NoCoast
I offered daily coverage for 8k per event for video.

A deal at twice the price.

Well at twice the price we would be getting a little closer to what others quoted it at.

---

Grant Hughes

Quote
NoCoast
Well at twice the price we would be getting a little closer to what others quoted it at.

And at your quoted price probably not sustainable.
(IE: would you still be doing it at a COLA $8K/event after three years? 6 years?)

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Quote
Morison
(IE: would you still be doing it at a COLA $8K/event after three years? 6 years?)

fuck three years from now and 6 years too. me want video this year. keep the cola.

COLA?

$8k per year was a sustainable budget. It was NOT something that you were going to be able to quit your day job and start your own production company but it was sustainable.
With today's resources, making a high quality rally production is easy if you have the correct focus and knowledge. You are NOT going to draw a bunch of new fans in with the level of driving that exists in the USA. You are NOT going to make money on your video production. Your video production exists to showcase the TEAMS in your series which allows them to potentially sell sponsorship and thus continue to come to your races. I feel like a broken record, the only thing important is competitor retention, get that right and you will succeed.
Now, if you get that retention, you get a higher level of competition, you get a more entertaining race, you get more viewers, you get better ratings, you attract more competitors, remember that retention thing from original, yeah, suddenly you have 200 car fields and waiting lists. It's just around the corner...

Shit, Chumpcar just announced a multi-year deal with Optima for series sponsorship and that's racing in cars that should have all probably been crushed that shouldn't have any marketability from a classroom standpoint.

Two days after the rally was over Rally America released a press release about what happened at the rally...

---

Grant Hughes

Quote
NoCoast
Shit, Chumpcar just announced a multi-year deal with Optima for series sponsorship and that's racing in cars that should have all probably been crushed that shouldn't have any marketability from a classroom standpoint.

but, on the other hand:
(stolen from some other forum, no idea on the accuracy)

Quote

Btw, new rules for 2014 just came out. Optima batteries required (but will be provided free in "standard" sizes).

Either way, I'd say this is clear evidence that we're "doing it wrong" - but the current plight of the WRC seems to indicate that at least we're not the only ones.

---

KF7RWG
http://www.utahrallygroup.com

Quote
brianallmotor
fuck three years from now and 6 years too. me want video this year. keep the cola.

Never heard of the marshmallow experiment and deferred gratification?

Tim.

Quote
TronDD
Never heard of the marshmallow experiment and deferred gratification?
Tim.

i've heard of youtube.

Tim, you are gay. deferred gratification it is not. go shove marshmellows up your tail pipe till you choose another analogy.

Quote
NoCoast
COLA?

Cost of living adjustment.
Built in to every long-term agreement I've ever done personally. (My main client is typically on a 5 year cycle)

Quote
NoCoast
$8k per year was a sustainable budget.

I don't beleive it is.
We could dicsuss this all day long and never agree on it so there isn't much point. The difference is likely down to what we each think 'sustainable' means.

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Quote
Morison

Quote
NoCoast
Well at twice the price we would be getting a little closer to what others quoted it at.

And at your quoted price probably not sustainable.
(IE: would you still be doing it at a COLA $8K/event after three years? 6 years?)

So on the one hand we have a guy who actually went out and shot video for multiple events, actually spent the money to film those events, actually tallied what it actually cost, actually produced the videos, which were actually uploaded, and that people across the country actually watched for event coverage, who wrote an actual proposal to perform this service, which he's done before, again.

On the other hand we have someone who has done none of those things, who thinks that maybe the other guy's plan isn't that good. Probably. Maybe. Because, like, it's another opinion.

I think I can easily state that I value the opinion of the person who has a measureable amount of personal experience over the the person who doesn't.

Cheers,
Anders

ps: COLA is likely "Cost Of Living Adjustment"... because, like, if $8,000 was enough this year but next year it would need $8136, well, I can't think of a bigger show stopper than that. I mean, dude, $136!!!!

---

Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

Quote
Morison

Quote
NoCoast
$8k per year was a sustainable budget.

I don't beleive it is.

Ha! So, it's like this fictional dramatization:

G: I offered to do it for $8k. It was sustainable at that point.
M: No it wasn't.
G: Actually, yeah, based on what my previous costs were.
M: I don't believe you.
G: I already know what it cost last time.
M: Those are the wrong costs, and they don't factor in what's going to happen six years from now.
G: It wasn't a six year offer. I mean, I have done it before.
M: No you haven't.
G: You can see the videos. They're on youtube.
M: No they aren't.
G: Yeah, like here's one [url=

]right here.[/url]
M: I don't see it.
G: I don't know what else to say.
M: Yes, we're never going to agree on this. You may as well stop arguing with me.

---

Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

Quote
Anders Green

Quote
Morison

Quote
NoCoast
$8k per year was a sustainable budget.

I don't beleive it is.

Ha! So, it's like this fictional dramatization:

G: I offered to do it for $8k. It was sustainable at that point.
M: No it wasn't.
G: Actually, yeah, based on what my previous costs were.
M: I don't believe you.
G: I already know what it cost last time.
M: Those are the wrong costs, and they don't factor in what's going to happen six years from now.
G: It wasn't a six year offer. I mean, I have done it before.
M: No you haven't.
G: You can see the videos. They're on youtube.
M: No they aren't.
G: Yeah, like here's one [url=

]right here.[/url]
M: I don't see it.
G: I don't know what else to say.
M: Yes, we're never going to agree on this. You may as well stop arguing with me.

[/quote]

Only the names are changed to protect the innocent....

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
[b]CALL +1 206 431-9696 [/b]
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

In Keith's defense he probably has had a experience with the CARS production, is aware of what it costs the series and what the production house does at events and such.
I can tell you what is different that makes us able to do it for less than others.
1) We own very little equipment we use and thus have almost no overhead.
2) We have a small core group and the rest are volunteers/day laborers essentially.
3) We have day jobs and are not trying to make a living or pay the bills with rally.

Also, I should correct myself, I figured the minimum production we could do around $8k. But my exact message to them said, "$8-12k per event range." Flights and rental car costs being the things that add the most variation.

We averaged around $2k spent per event doing Max Attack coverage. The bulk of the $6k difference was by paying ourselves marginally, rental cars (since can't always borrow Billy Irvin's 4Runner or Ben Slocum's Jetta or Justin Carven's pickup) and RENTING production quality equipment. I'm not talking Reds or Phantoms or $50k cameras, I'm talking something that produces HD in a format we can edit that is acceptable to a cable network and available from a local group.

The conversation ended with this message before Sno Drift last year. "How I am trying to implement that is to find people who are already proficient to some extent both in video and in Rally to assist us in order to alleviate as much of the necessary training as possible. We are trying to get a list put together of available people who would be interested in helping out at Sno*Drift 2012, our first attempt at our new video portfolio. We would likely take care of all expenses but would not be paying for services on top of that."

---

Grant Hughes

Meh...
I've seen grants work, knew he's done them and know he can do them for $8k.
Never said anything different.
I was questioning the sustainability - more important from a buyer's perspective than a supplier.

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.