Looks like the fast Euro test may come to pass at Oregon....

Watching the Oz championship for '12 is incredable. Those guys are very fast at the clubman level. Having seen the ability of Powers to show up on strange roads with a slightly unconventional rally car and just fly with it is really neat.

The Finns are fast, well the spectators are anyway, I can't believe how quickly they remove the wrecks from the road.

Always seems two things occur...10 cars go off on the same corner (many understeering right into oblivion) and 20 spectators clean up the damage in seconds. We have many millionaire politicians who can't get stuff cleaned up that fast...

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john vanlandingham
*snip*

Your whole post is a cliche for exactly what is wrong with discussion on the internet. Nothing to back up anything you say, attacks on the character/person the argument is with, this is practically comedic gold John. At most, referencing statistics from over a decade ago that don't prove your point.

And the most hilarious part? THIS IS A DISCUSSION/DEBATE. Your anecdotal evidence and "musings" are not fact, therefore, there is discussion/debate to be had. You aren't the wisest ralliest in North America. You don't know all. Maybe if you ate some of the humble pie you throw around at others on a daily basis and could admit that you aren't always right, these conversations wouldn't always go this way.

A conversation with you John isn't just for you to dump your "knowledge" into somebody. It should be a learning experience for both individuals. Sadly, you'll (probably) never see that.

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HiTempguy

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john vanlandingham
*snip*

Your whole post is a cliche for exactly what is wrong with discussion on the internet. Nothing to back up anything you say, attacks on the character/person the argument is with, this is practically comedic gold John. At most, referencing statistics from over a decade ago that don't prove your point.

And the most hilarious part? THIS IS A DISCUSSION/DEBATE. Your anecdotal evidence and "musings" are not fact, therefore, there is discussion/debate to be had. You aren't the wisest ralliest in North America. You don't know all. Maybe if you ate some of the humble pie you throw around at others on a daily basis and could admit that you aren't always right, these conversations wouldn't always go this way.

A conversation with you John isn't just for you to dump your "knowledge" into somebody. It should be a learning experience for both individuals. Sadly, you'll (probably) never see that.

What is it you are saying---ever? Nothing at all except whatever "musing" you have, and NEVER a reference to anything other than your own extremely limited experience...not that you don't "prove" anything, you don't even try to reference anything--not previous whatever happened, no even allusion to anything except Adam Vokes whim..


All I see is "this is what I think:____________________" with no reference hinted at....

You make the mistake constantly which most people in isolation do too often: Mistake the right of everybody to have an opinion with the silly idea that all opinions are equal.
Seriously, you say I "attack the person'. Wrong. I attack the persons vague and ill founded opinions....
Huge and obvious difference.
The bizarre thing is even when you change your mind post facto and ponder doing something previously suggested--which you argued with---you don't ever say anything on the lines of "Well shit, I guess what some of you guys were saying might have been ______________(right, smart, reasoned, whatever)...
For example the poinlessness of wasting so much on race gas, or the pointlessness of the turbo 4wd arms race....both of which you've mused about after arguing and justifying the opposite.

The main thing that puzzles me when you and other young, inexperienced, and ill-schooled guys like you argue and waste everybody's time "debating" is there is this burning desire to negate, prove wrong, prove some ego-maniaical thing in ME.

If you were a more generous person and not so achingly full of, as far as we can tell, only yourself, you might reflect as to why some---each in their own way----give their time and care to do what they can: TO HELP guys build solid affordable cars that are fun, or others to secure roads and permits, or others to be registrars, or scrutineers or service crews or build engines that work good....so there are rallies..and crews..and cars again and again...

Nope you just want to prove that I'm an egomaniac, that is you're whole point..
Well guess what, kid...You don't do anything beyond the ordinary without a strong will...

The original idea "These European Australians will prove or disprove that....."
I guess that "Youse guys" are "fast" and that importantly "John is wrong"..

What a strange thing to waste time on.

Kinda like the idea of rooting for some pro football team and if they win, "being proud or OUR team"...Strange thought process.

By the way Adam when you keep repeating "You attack people" think of this: when you write stuff like "I'm (you) one of the more seasoned" or whatever that phrase was, ever think that that is an attack? It is. An attack on all of us who read it and an attack on logic and reasoning...
Of course you don't see it as such cause you said it...

But it is.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

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john vanlandingham
Seriously, you say I "attack the person'. Wrong. I attack the persons vague and ill founded opinions....

Wanting the above to be true... even believing that the above is true... is not the same as making it true.

You often start one of your attacks by making fun of the ideas that the person expressed. If you stopped at that point, you'd be abrasive, but not an asshole. But you rarely stop there. That's your problem.

I like how "manufacturer's points" requires no direct support of teams. It's a win-win for them.. and they get a trophy at the end.

I like pie and watch history channel, so I'll just add something useful to this thread.

History of shoelaces

The history of shoelaces goes hand in hand with the historical record of shoes. Shoelaces were required to secure the shoe to the foot. Archaeological records provide examples of ways shoes were fastened to the foot. Simple pieces of leather were bound to the foot and ankle with laces and were used in 2000 B.C. during ancient Mesopotamians times. Ancient Greeks wore sandals with rawhide lacing. Roman soldiers popularized the use of shoes and therefore shoelaces to Western Europe.

Shoelaces, as we know them today, did not become widely popular until the 20th century. Before this point, shoes were fastened with buttons or buckled. In the Museum of London, there is an example of medieval footwear from the 12th century. This historical document shows a shoe with lacing down the front and side of the shoe through a series of hooks. Some historical records suggest that the shoestring was first invented in England on March 27, 1790.

Yep copy and paste because all y'alls are crazy in spending time writing in this discussion. We all know John has a stiffy for the finns which is fine, but things are different and the trend started changing during the Sainz years.

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Iowa999

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john vanlandingham
Seriously, you say I "attack the person'. Wrong. I attack the persons vague and ill founded opinions....

Wanting the above to be true... even believing that the above is true... is not the same as making it true.

You often start one of your attacks by making fun of the ideas that the person expressed. If you stopped at that point, you'd be abrasive, but not an asshole. But you rarely stop there. That's your problem.

Again, what is offensive and abrasive depends on a point of view. I find virtually everything you write and the conceited manner you write abrasive and offensive, thus I respond how I do to you...to do otherwise would be illogical, and pointless.

It all depends on the point of view... If the exact same words, phrases and examples are taken by 80% as friendly, helpful, sometimes amusing--for what you pay, you can't expect top level humor, and 20% find it annoying and argumentative; when some, just some find things "offensive" it could be that they are looking for offense..

Conversely when some, like you, come to just bullshit, and demand reinforcement for nonsense you have already decided to do, some don't find that "offensive" ---maybe because that is what they do routinely---but some do find it generally offensive...

Same words---polar opposite reactions, well not much I can do..

Some may not find your tone, and manner offensive---I do.
Thoroughly.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Quote
john vanlandingham
Again, what is offensive and abrasive depends on a point of view. I find virtually everything you write and the conceited manner you write abrasive and offensive, thus I respond how I do to you...to do otherwise would be illogical, and pointless.

It all depends on the point of view... If the exact same words, phrases and examples are taken by 80% as friendly, helpful, sometimes amusing--for what you pay, you can't expect top level humor, and 20% find it annoying and argumentative; when some, just some find things "offensive" it could be that they are looking for offense..

Conversely when some, like you, come to just bullshit, and demand reinforcement for nonsense you have already decided to do, some don't find that "offensive" ---maybe because that is what they do routinely---but some do find it generally offensive...

Same words---polar opposite reactions, well not much I can do..

Some may not find your tone, and manner offensive---I do.
Thoroughly.

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

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john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2013 06:47PM by Morison.

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john vanlandingham
Some may not find your tone, and manner offensive---I do.
Thoroughly.

That's cool. But, as pointed out above, you clearly have no clue what "offensive" means, because I can tell you that my intention is not to annoy. In contrast, there is no way that your way of writing, given your obvious (albeit wasted) intelligence, can have any purpose except to annoy.

Keith for prez!

Uh, I mean... wait a minute

Also John, once again, your opinion 80/20 (is, uh, quite generous in your unbiased favour of the poll you obviously took) does'nt make it fact. In 'fact', I came to the conclusion that you pushing the 0.05% of the population that actually rallies into the idea of doing massive amounts of fab work and crawling through junkyards has probably kept more people out of rallying than starting.

Did Kevin ever get that steering rack welded together? Cause thats totally within your average car dudes abilities... last I saw, the car was in pieces and he was going 'this is turning out to be more diificult than I thought'

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HiTempguy
Keith for prez!

Uh, I mean... wait a minute

Also John, once again, your opinion 80/20 (is, uh, quite generous in your unbiased favour of the poll you obviously took) does'nt make it fact. In 'fact', I came to the conclusion that you pushing the 0.05% of the population that actually rallies into the idea of doing massive amounts of fab work and crawling through junkyards has probably kept more people out of rallying than starting.

Did Kevin ever get that steering rack welded together? Cause thats totally within your average car dudes abilities... last I saw, the car was in pieces and he was going 'this is turning out to be more diificult than I thought'

Troll-boy, you going to try and troll about an EXAMPLE? 80/20... PROVE with FACTS that it isn't.
Come on punk, let's see you do something OTHER THAN FLAP YOUR opinions...


What a tiresome boy you are Adam, a really immature annoying tiresome boy..
There that's an opinion.

PROVE for a FACT that you are not an annoying TROLLING tiresome boy.
Prove my opinion is wrong with some of your facts.


What a joke.

Must be the water..

Prove it's not the water that makes you do nothiing but complain about people and troll.

Back up your facts.


.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Guys, come on. John can't be wrong.

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

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Dazed_Driver
Guys, come on. John can't be wrong.

John Kerry is heading this way right after the Korean crisis is calmed down.