Nameless Rally Cloquallum Stage

Ok, after reviewing rallyracingnews.com I apologize for any insinuations, implied or otherwise, about Adam's co-driving experience.

If you do and Adam does, great. However I stand my my comment that most codrivers don't.

---

Self-righteous douche canoe

Quote
hoche
However I stand my my comment that most codrivers don't.

Assuming you mean most codrivers you know or the oh so popular everyone I talk to then how can I argue.
But, I think maybe there is also a need to define what you mean by 'using' an odo on notes. If you mean regularly cross referencing the odo with the notes, then I'd agree with you. I'd also agree that you should be able to make it through a stage successfully without using an odo.

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Hints coming to terms! Fun video!

---

Grant Hughes

Quote
hoche

Quote
HiTempguy
Also, does nobody use a rally computer anymore? If the route book had the corner marked, it'd have a distance, which would show on the rally computer, which should have your co-driver bopping you guys in the head with the routebook if you weren't listening

It's comments like that that make me wonder how much rally experience a poster has.

Very few people use the odo on stage when they have notes.

one thing I noticed at OTR was that when I was trying to give a note to competitors about where there was an off and a lot of cars off the side of the road that weren't there the previous run through, was that those who had no mileage anywhere were not able to find where to write down the note

so, for all of the "notes make it safer" and "notes make it faster" these teams now didn't have a clue where I was talking about, but everyone using a route book did

Quote
tipo158

Quote
hoche
Never was much a fan of Van Way. I've seen him drive and sort of filed him in the "mediocre driver, big budget" category. Lost more respect for him after seeing him in a meltdown at an event a few years ago. He seems to've done pretty well in the two stages he made it through though. I'm wondering how he rolled.

I wouldn't want to have been Goodwin's co-driver when they passed the car that Goodwin rented to Van Way rolled on stage.

On Sunday, Van Way was 1st on stage 9 and 2nd on stage 8, 10, 11 (tied with Derik) & 12. Too bad he had a some kind of incident on stage 7.

Is this the first time he has competitively run an AWD car?

alan

Yes first time with AWD in competition. The roll was a bummer. We did a quick test with the car down in Oregon before the event and he was having trouble just getting comfortable in the car (seating position) and the brake situation was not good (still had OEM power brakes, and DVW is very much into left foot braking coming from his Fiesta). Lots of quick fixes were tried but no time to re-do the whole brake system properly so that certainly did not contribute to his comfort level.

I haven't known him all that long but been around him at all the national events this year, and he is one of the nicest kids I have met in a long time. Cool family also, all into riding dirt bikes.

---

John Reed
John Reed Racing
www.johnreedracing.com
johnreedracing@gmail.com

Quote
hoche

It's comments like that that make me wonder how much rally experience a poster has.

Hooboy! Good thing I kept reading and somebody was being reasonable. You almost got hit with a whole dose of HiTempguy's finest internet rage (I'm on the road to Baie, gotta release it somehow when pentup in a truck all day).

Anyways, this is the EXACT reason I am a big supporter of recce. This incident would have NOT happened had (experienced, well learnded) people been recce'ing.

Edit-
And as usual, Keith basically said anything of importance I had to say on the subject, including when/where/why it is appropriate to cross reference the odo when on stage at speed (which most definitely is NOT all the time, that would be impossible on pace notes).

I find this a bit hilarious though, I knew who Mike was, but he doesn't know me. Am I the only one that reads EVERYTHING on Rally Anarchy, and then checks to see who people's names are and what they've done?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2013 09:44AM by HiTempguy.

Quote
HiTempguy


Anyways, this is the EXACT reason I am a big supporter of recce. This incident would have NOT happened had (experienced, well learnded) people been recce'ing.

As long as we're doing what-is and whose-whats...I've heard rumors that the issue may have started when an experienced competitor (who realized that this was a shortcut during recce) blew through the tape on purpose.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2013 10:09AM by fliz.

Quote
12xalt
...one thing I noticed at OTR was that when I was trying to give a note to competitors about where there was an off and a lot of cars off the side of the road that weren't there the previous run through, was that those who had no mileage anywhere were not able to find where to write down the note

What really annoys me is when the location of a car is given to me as 'between instruction 9 and 10,' which has probably happened more often than not for me in the US. Give a distance and I can deal with that.

Quote
12xalt
...so, for all of the "notes make it safer" and "notes make it faster" these teams now didn't have a clue where I was talking about, but everyone using a route book did

Yah, but if the car was left for the next running then it will be in a safe place and clearly marked as an 'old' off and OK.

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Quote
Morison

Quote
12xalt
...one thing I noticed at OTR was that when I was trying to give a note to competitors about where there was an off and a lot of cars off the side of the road that weren't there the previous run through, was that those who had no mileage anywhere were not able to find where to write down the note

What really annoys me is when the location of a car is given to me as 'between instruction 9 and 10,' which has probably happened more often than not for me in the US. Give a distance and I can deal with that.

Quote
12xalt
...so, for all of the "notes make it safer" and "notes make it faster" these teams now didn't have a clue where I was talking about, but everyone using a route book did

Yah, but if the car was left for the next running then it will be in a safe place and clearly marked as an 'old' off and OK.

Yeah, I was giving mileage.

And it was in a safe place, as was all the extraction vehicles, but at least knowing something was there now that wasn't before, imo, was a good thing.

Quote
HiTempguy
Anyways, this is the EXACT reason I am a big supporter of recce. This incident would have NOT happened had (experienced, well learnded) people been recce'ing.

I'm sorry- but no matter how many events you have under your belt... You simply cannot know this without being there and seeing the exact situation. But maybe I'm not well learnded enough to know any better. You do realize that this event DID have recce - two pass, write-your-own notes style.

Do you have notes from a rally that show the ODO reading for every single corner? We have an odo running on stage, and if we do get totally lost, it's a great reference.

I have great in-car video of this corner that I was thinking about posting. It would be helpful for all to see and analyze and learn from. There are some nice cues visible in the video (like heavy braking marks where some previous teams stopped and backed up, and then the total lack of tracks). But I'm not sure that I'm open to the video making me look like an apparent idiot (or not experienced enough or whatever). This is the first time in 10 years of rallying that I've ever left the stage road for any reason.

Doug



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2013 10:33AM by Doug Heredos.

Quote
Doug Heredos
I'm sorry- but no matter how many events you have under your belt... You simply cannot know this without being there and seeing the exact situation.

Hmmm... you haven't met Adam then have you. :-)

I'd be interested in seeing the video for sure. With 13 cars taking the wrong direction there has to be something to learn in this.

Quote
Doug Heredos
Do you have notes from a rally that show the ODO reading for every single corner?

Not every corner, but the advice I give in the codriver schools is actually to get a good distance on a distinct corner just before any really important corners. (something tight, off camber, or a junction - which we don't see a lot of out here)

---

First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

Quote
john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Quote
Morison

Quote
Doug Heredos
I'm sorry- but no matter how many events you have under your belt... You simply cannot know this without being there and seeing the exact situation.

Hmmm... you haven't met Adam then have you. :-)

I'd be interested in seeing the video for sure. With 13 cars taking the wrong direction there has to be something to learn in this.

Quote
Doug Heredos
Do you have notes from a rally that show the ODO reading for every single corner?

Not every corner, but the advice I give in the codriver schools is actually to get a good distance on a distinct corner just before any really important corners. (something tight, off camber, or a junction - which we don't see a lot of out here)

Yeah a lesson on Blind leading the Blind...

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Yes please, I'd like very much to see this corner.

---

Jay Woodward
Snohomish, WA
'90 Mazdog Frankenprotege
Chronologically, 46...

Quote
Morison

Not every corner, but the advice I give in the codriver schools is actually to get a good distance on a distinct corner just before any really important corners. (something tight, off camber, or a junction - which we don't see a lot of out here)

How do you use this information in practice? Do you look at the ODO and compare to your reference/noted distance regularly? Or only if you suspect you are lost in the notes? I would expect your note for a particular corner to be all the information that the driver needs unless you get lost.

We get an extra reference here in the PNW- Every instruction in the routebook gets a corresponding stake and arrow (with instruction number) on course. So, if for whatever reason you have no clue where you are, you can drive blind until you see the next instruction arrow and if you have that referenced in your notes, you're back on track. The instruction arrows are usually many per mile, so there are enough to be useful.

Doug

Quote
Doug Heredos

Quote
Morison

Not every corner, but the advice I give in the codriver schools is actually to get a good distance on a distinct corner just before any really important corners. (something tight, off camber, or a junction - which we don't see a lot of out here)

How do you use this information in practice? Do you look at the ODO and compare to your reference/noted distance regularly? Or only if you suspect you are lost in the notes? I would expect your note for a particular corner to be all the information that the driver needs unless you get lost.

We get an extra reference here in the PNW- Every instruction in the routebook gets a corresponding stake and arrow (with instruction number) on course. So, if for whatever reason you have no clue where you are, you can drive blind until you see the next instruction arrow and if you have that referenced in your notes, you're back on track. The instruction arrows are usually many per mile, so there are enough to be useful.

Doug

Yeah thank goodness for the numbered Instruction signs......saved my ass several times per event..

yeah put the vid up.. I wonder if the churned up nature is like hypnotic to drivers?
They see chewed up surface, brain shuts out all the yapping from the ballast?
We've seen similar in aircraft following eachother..and they don't even chew up the sky.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.