CARS Class Rule Change Proposal

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Gravity Fed
E85 is still considered pump, no? Which is still rather potent as a fuel option.

Well I am still in a fix for it..Is there any other alternative methods for it?
So We can have the best solutions.

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car classifieds

I'm not absolutely sure what my merkur weighs, but if its under the minimum(and I suspect it is) am I expected to attach weights? Or get placed into my own class? Either way, it would be a deciding factor in whether to compete in Canada at all. I was at Big White last year, planning on it again this year as well as trying out PFR. But this is getting kind of silly. Its already a long-ish tow.

Not that one competitor really matters...

I DO, however, agree about the rotary engines. Those things have been dominating rallies for YEARS. About time someone put a stop to them!

The answer to that lies in 'if' western Canada continues to include Group 5 in addition to the new, friendlier, Open 2wd rules. For this year's PFR and Big White the rules stand and Gr5, without a minimum weight, continues to be recognized. There would likely be a discussion on the future of Gr5 at Big White, which gives you even more reason to be there.

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Its already a long-ish tow.

Your profile says Yakima WA... not what I would call a long tow. (many of the volunteers travel just about that far, if not further)

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First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

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john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Length of tow always depends on perspective. Anything less than 1200 miles is reasonable from Denver. Live in Seattle/Portland corridor and that number could become 250.

My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

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Grant Hughes

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Morison

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Its already a long-ish tow.

Your profile says Yakima WA... not what I would call a long tow. (many of the volunteers travel just about that far, if not further)

And thus the "-ish" They are both a longer tow for me than Olympus, Oregon Trail, Mt Hood, and Idaho. I guess I'm a bit spoiled.

Good to hear that this year will not be affected by whatever changes are made to the rules. You can count on the merkur in all its group 5 splendor at Big White. Speaking of Big White, if EVER there was an event in which group 5 gave absolutely NO advantage...

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NoCoast
My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

I think rally ready we are at 2750 or so. I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

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Slowwpoke

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NoCoast
My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

I think rally ready we are at 2750 or so. I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Who knows..
I tried to clarify with logic that was missing in the original proposition

And suggest some less coarse steps--with intermediate cc/weights, but the normal procedure is to announce what they want, and only if they create a firestorm will they maybe change things, but NEVER EVER acknowledge that there was unclarity or errors.

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

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Slowwpoke

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NoCoast
My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

I think rally ready we are at 2750 or so. I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Grants car has at least 100lbs of dust...

Funny how a well driven, nose heavy, poorly geared POS can dominate two events in a row with no more power than a well built 4cyl G2 car.

Maybe if the Canadian drivers spent as much time on technique as lobbying to reduce competition....

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heymagic

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Slowwpoke

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NoCoast
My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

I think rally ready we are at 2750 or so. I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Grants car has at least 100lbs of dust...

Funny how a well driven, nose heavy, poorly geared POS can dominate two events in a row with no more power than a well built 4cyl G2 car.

Maybe if the Canadian drivers spent as much time on technique as lobbying to reduce competition....

Those Canadians...ahead in healthcare and being civilized, but just now catching up to 1980s SCCA autocross in their motorsports regulating!

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Andrew Steere
Lyndeborough, NH
KB1PJY

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heymagic

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Slowwpoke

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NoCoast
My Merkur was at 2650 so you are probably close. Probably fine with full rally tool/spare, etc.

I think rally ready we are at 2750 or so. I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Grants car has at least 100lbs of dust...

Funny how a well driven, nose heavy, poorly geared POS can dominate two events in a row with no more power than a well built 4cyl G2 car.

Maybe if the Canadian drivers spent as much time on technique as lobbying to reduce competition....

Imagine how well they'd go if they had a peppy 2.3 that weight 150 lbs less.

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

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john vanlandingham

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Slowwpoke
I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Who knows..

People who can read?
The proposal is clear that unrestricted forced induction cars would be 2900lbs.

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john vanlandingham
I tried to clarify...

How?
Posting here doesn't count. Did you send an email to the head of the committee?

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First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

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john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/02/2013 11:28AM by Morison.

I take back most of my earlier post. I guess I miss read the clear writing and didnt catch the restrictor part of the rule. I read it as under 2.5 with turbo 2750 over 2.5 with turbo 2900. Over 3.0 liter non turbo 2900. I would drop the turbo restrictor all together just like before there is no reason for it other then to drive up cost witch is counter productive. I also would drop the N/A wieght down to 2750 with over 2.5 liter. 2.5 or less no wieght limit. Wieght is the real and only way to make talent verses car prep even.

I do not care how much people say talent is the equalizer.Yes it is very evident in rally that talent makes a very big differance. But having close to equal car dimentions engines and wieghts helps better prove true talent.

Not sure if its the engine displacement or the fact that rear wheel drive is truly faster then fwd but the rise of rwd is evident and CARS needs to be ready for the new wave of cars. if thats BMW's, BRZ's or 240's with 3.5 liter engines that wieght 2700 then thats who they need to cater to not get rid of with these new rules.

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First rally 2013
Rally car type AWD subaru
Total rallies as driver 6
Total rally cars built 2
Total rally cars caged 3
Total rally cars repaired from offs 4
Total years racing exp other then rally 19 yrs
Like 31motorsports on FB!
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Morison

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john vanlandingham

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Slowwpoke
I thought the rule proposal specifies a minimum weight of 2900? Or am I reading it wrong?

Who knows..

People who can read?
The proposal is clear that unrestricted forced induction cars would be 2900lbs.

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john vanlandingham
I tried to clarify...

How?
Posting here doesn't count. Did you send an email to the head of the committee?

No,did you when you read the way I explained what they had overlooked ?
Did you when it was shown to be logical and clear--clearer compared to theirs.?

Your're Canadian---as far as I know, and I presume you are in constant contact being whatever it is "media Promotions head"--or whatever the fuck, presumably you should be interested in seeing happy membership that you can Promote their antics to the Media, so it seems logical that you would have forwards the suggestions you come across---rather than sitting on your growing bottom and ask me if I had.....it doesn't matter who does, it does matter if one is normally in contact or real fucking busy with 30 project while now minding the girls all day cause school is out....

So. Did you?

If not why not?

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

I think the crux of the matter comes down to one important philosophy. This philosophy can apply to business, rally, or really any sport.

Restriction hinders innovation.
Putting restrictions on RWD or FWD rally cars will simply reduce the competitor pool. Someone that is interested in rallying may decide to instead build a car for Time Attack or Drifting as opposed to rallying. Look at the interest generated by the Nameless BRZ. Had they been required to add weight and deal with restrictors would they instead decided it was more worthwhile to build the car for Time Attack where they wouldn't have those restrictions. The lessons learned on that car can be directly applied to work they will do on customer cars. That would NOT be the case if they were dealing with a restrictor. Cobb Tuning's supercharged BRZ that is running Time Attack (Caswell has done a few events for them in it), should be running in rally but Time Attack is a better market for them and that car. Adding roadblocks and detriments to competition is never good for a sport.

Let's do a business analogy. You are essentially adding a new tax to a selective group of competitors, current, new, and potential future. Each rally team is essentially a small business. New taxes on small businesses unilaterally hurt small business and economies.

Give 2WD open a try. If shit gets out of control, then address if a resolution needs to occur. Stop trying to preemptively invent problems that don't exist and instead work harder to address problems that do.

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Grant Hughes