Comparing 2 cars quantitatively with some known variables...
Posted by ReluctantGolf
ReluctantGolf Kevin Andrade Junior Moderator Location: Boston, MA Join Date: 07/15/2013 Posts: 55 Rally Car: VW Mk2 Golf for my rookie year in SCCA RallyX...MK2 GLI with 1.8T for my first event.. |
you are right. car #2 is a fiesta and car #1 is a 2L golf (mk4 vintage). I am staring at that weight differential of close to 400lbs which from what I can tell is mostly distributed across the whole car with maybe an extra 50lbs in the engine bay. I own the fiesta already (I bought it as a daily and for general running around on the weekends) and have a fairly low cost basis for it.....probably pretty close to what I would need to pay for a very good condition mk4 with low miles. The fiesta has next to no power upgrades from the stock figures but the availability of parts and support (LSD, gears, brakes etc) is very high. The golf has about the same availability of parts and LSD and brake upgrades but the power upgrades end somewhere higher than what is available to the Fiesta. For the mk4 golf, with very basic bolt-ons like a proper race header, exhaust and cam and chip install, it sounds like achieving about 145hp and about the same tq is very feasible. My question I guess is whether this increased amount of power compensates for the 400lbs weight difference between the two cars? Thats what I am trying to drive at....how would you compare the 2 cars given the weight differential but with the small bit of extra power on the heavier car? I am trying to stay as stock as possible and stay more modern than old mk2 and 3. For this reason I am looking at the mk4 golf with a 2L |
NoCoast Grant Hughes Mega Moderator Location: Whitefish, MT Join Date: 01/11/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 6,818 Rally Car: BMW |
It's such a fine line between modern and ancient. With modern you get alot of benefits like rust free, better wiring typically, and less abuse but also a few distinct disadvantages such as more complicated electronics, CANBUS possibly, extra weight, etc. I do like the idea of keeping things closer to stock from a reliability standpoint though.
If I were choosing between the two I'd probably pick the Fiesta but that's because I've owned a Mk4 Golf TDI and the only thing I liked about the car was the fuel economy. Grant Hughes |
Josh Wimpey Josh Wimpey Infallible Moderator Location: VA Join Date: 12/27/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 649 Rally Car: Sneak the Golf |
The mk4 golf is a bit bigger and heavier than a Fiesta for sure.
Who knows which one has the worst, most complicated, and most fussy to modify wiring.... The Golf can be lightened below 2900lbs quite easily and should end up well under 2700 ready to race unless you just cage it and don't trim the fat first---something you should do regardless of the chassis chosen and power available. Power options are also limitless. With bolt-in engine swaps that easily make 300hp. And now with USRT making a cast manifold for the 2.0 motor that 1.8t plumbing hooks right up to, you don't even have to do a swap, just tuning and injectors. So, if you outgrow 2700lbs and 145hp, you are set for easy upgrade paths. ____________________________________________________________- One. Class -- 2WD www.quantumrallysport.com http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/Quantum-Rally-Sport/281129179600?ref=nf |
john vanlandingham John Vanlandingham Infallible Moderator Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA Join Date: 12/20/2005 Age: Fossilized Posts: 14,152 Rally Car: Saab 96 V4 |
Reason I said two columns is its easier to make straight across per-entage calculations and then see % differences..Like 14% weight. Everything is a comparison like compare and contrast. Like 'this is 0,2% more, fuckit" this is 30% more, Hmmmmmmmmm" Or Hmmmmm 14% weight more but 15% more torque and 20% shorter gearing---more torque multiplication, look veeeeery interestink"... And then there IS the cost for mods... As for the like to keep it closer to stock for "reliability"...Well there is a third alternative :learn how to make reliable stuff and do more yourself....but that takes effort and experience.. Who wants to do that? meh better to just have 125 stock ft/lbs and give away 30% in gearing..Easier. John Vanlandingham Sleezattle, WA, USA Vive le Prole-le-ralliat www.rallyrace.net/jvab CALL +1 206 431-9696 Remember! Pacific Standard Time is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time. |
Josh Wimpey Josh Wimpey Infallible Moderator Location: VA Join Date: 12/27/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 649 Rally Car: Sneak the Golf |
a nice lookin mk4 and mk2 golf for sale over on specialstage.
The mk4 needs rally suspenders and a thicker bit of aluminium under the motor --- a smaller turbo maxxing out around 250hp probably wouldn't hurt either. The GTX2863 is smallish by street tuner standards but probably doesn't make full boost till 3700rpm or higher on a 1.8 liter. ALS could probably fix that problem too but may cost more than downsizing. The mk2 is getting it's engine rebuilt to make it saleable. Has a way rad dogbox with proper ratios. Could also benefit from real gravel suspension rather than the short Bilstein "Rally" Group A stuff that is on there. ____________________________________________________________- One. Class -- 2WD www.quantumrallysport.com http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/Quantum-Rally-Sport/281129179600?ref=nf |
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