Not Trolling Keith Morison Junior Moderator Location: Calgary, AB Join Date: 09/15/2015 Age: Ancient Posts: 340 |
All I'm saying is that if you were insistent enough to get ahead of him that it turned into a confrontation, you'd want to be sure it was the right place to be.
Often I see a LOT of fuss about road position when it generally doesn't mean a whole lot of difference. At Oregon a couple years ago a driver who was on the road behind us unilaterally exited the regroup control early so he could get 'better' road position. (times out were assigned when you got to the exit, so no penalties...) I looked at the scores later and he ended up behind a car that was a fair bit slower than us. First Rally attended (2000), First Rally competed in (2001) Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0) Driver (8), Co-Driver (47), Drivers (19) Clerk (29), Steward (1), Official (17), Volunteer (5) WRC Spectator (1), WRC Photographer (6), WRC Observer (4) Rallies attended (120) Countries attended rallies in (11) Last Updated, May30, 2022 |
turoc Ozgur Simsek Mod Moderator Location: Brooklyn, NY Join Date: 06/07/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 561 Rally Car: working on a Veedub |
As i said we didn't care too much about seed but we were concerned with the last real stage being 25miles and one before being 13. It was Paul's first time being in an open awd car besides a stage or two and he is a committed driver. Open class car on a flat out 25m stage had a huge advantage. Another car that knew we were faster offered us to go ahead the stage before and we both agreed to stay where we were and would go infront at start of 13miler. We were putting 30-40 secs on 8miles or so. Thats when the reseed happened. Im not excluding the organizers of being at fault either. It was a poor decision to do reseed when there wasnt even a regroup. We only had 2 or 3 mins to spare to check in at our actual time and were told to immediately go in front of Millen who was a few feet from atc. We also started feeling a vibration at 50mph+ where we had to back off, pull over on long stage and lose 2mins+ which may or may not be a result of the incident. Again, his response was improper when asked about it with a cool head. He wont get that same courtesy again!
rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!! |
Ahh... that's odd. All of our interactions with them have been pleasant. That sucks it wasn't the case for you. I was asking about the runout as it seems a few stages each event have SKETCHY short runouts after the stage. We came blazing into one at Rally Idaho this last weekend and stopped pretty much NEXT to the car just as they were handing out their time card. We were given a 2min start gap for the rest of the day after that. |
turoc Ozgur Simsek Mod Moderator Location: Brooklyn, NY Join Date: 06/07/2006 Age: Midlife Crisis Posts: 561 Rally Car: working on a Veedub |
I just looked at the results now and we beat Millen more than just one stage and more than 3 secs a time. WM stages we backed off thought were at a good pace but lost some time. Even on a stage we lost a bunch of time after car stalling on a hairpin and struggling to fire up beat him by 20secs rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!! |
Not Trolling Keith Morison Junior Moderator Location: Calgary, AB Join Date: 09/15/2015 Age: Ancient Posts: 340 |
I stand corrected. I didn't dig enough into the scores online... not a fan of that presentation of data. He beat you on some, you beat him on others... you had issues, he probably had issues. In the end, I'm still not sure why this is worth talking about. The TLDR would be 'rally co-driver annoyed by rally driver with a bit of ego.' First Rally attended (2000), First Rally competed in (2001) Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0) Driver (8), Co-Driver (47), Drivers (19) Clerk (29), Steward (1), Official (17), Volunteer (5) WRC Spectator (1), WRC Photographer (6), WRC Observer (4) Rallies attended (120) Countries attended rallies in (11) Last Updated, May30, 2022 Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2017 04:48PM by Not Trolling. |
hoche Michel Hoche-Mong Super Moderator Location: Campbell, CA Join Date: 02/28/2006 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,156 Rally Car: Golf, Golf, RX-3 |
Looking at the scores, this is roughly what should have happened:
1) Paulo should have started behind Ryan, based on Paulo's Honda times and there not being much record of Paulo's AWD experience. 2) Ryan ran faster than Paulo for the first three stages. If there was a midday reseed, it should have left Ryan in front of Paulo. 3) Paulo ran faster than Ryan for the rest of the day. Not much, but consistently enough that the organizers should have reseeded Paulo in front of Ryan for day 2, especially considering Paulo beat him on the day by over 27 seconds after being down nearly 40 seconds after stage 2. 4) On day 2, Paulo was won by 2.5 and then lost by 6 and then won 2.8 and then lost by 14, so if there was a reseed at that point it would have most likely put Ryan in front. However, on the next stage Paulo won by 21 so that would have put Paulo back in front. So it just kinda depends on when they did the reseed. 5) It was clear that they were running close enough together in times that they weren't going to be catching each other, so as an official I probably wouldn't have worried about it too much. I don't buy the argument that "Open class car on a flat out 25m stage had a huge advantage." In fact, by my projections Paulo would have been +/- 20 seconds of Ryan. Self-righteous douche canoe |
Was there a way for them to know that info at the time?
Unless they were keeping track of Millen's times specifically (why would they? Especially if they aren't in the same class and leap frogging cars), who knows. They were told to do something and they did it. You don't really see the true nature of people until you are in conflict. Sometimes the nice guy shtick melts away. Of course, it could just be heat of the moment as well. |
hoche Michel Hoche-Mong Super Moderator Location: Campbell, CA Join Date: 02/28/2006 Age: Possibly Wise Posts: 1,156 Rally Car: Golf, Golf, RX-3 |
No doubt. That wasn't the point of my little exercise. Self-righteous douche canoe |
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Not Trolling Keith Morison Junior Moderator Location: Calgary, AB Join Date: 09/15/2015 Age: Ancient Posts: 340 |
Like I said, generally road order arguments are over rated.
First Rally attended (2000), First Rally competed in (2001) Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0) Driver (8), Co-Driver (47), Drivers (19) Clerk (29), Steward (1), Official (17), Volunteer (5) WRC Spectator (1), WRC Photographer (6), WRC Observer (4) Rallies attended (120) Countries attended rallies in (11) Last Updated, May30, 2022 Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2017 02:21AM by Not Trolling. |