Karma is a bitch

You go fuck with a guy's rally in favour of another one and see what happens.

Unfortunately in both cases, Reno and Wild West, poor competitors got fucked.
It pisses me off to see that there are asskissers who still refuse to consider both rallies CLUSTERFUCKS that proved the rule of 7Ps. Porper Planing and Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

I am so glad I didn't run either, otherwise I would probably be arrested by now. I wonder if they are considering refunding anything to the competitors.

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Cheers
M.Samli
Phoenix AZ
Gaylant VR4
EVO III GSR (Stolen)


Rallies are no place for traitors

Yup.

Wild West was a Travis and Ken show apparently. Mitch was so pissed off they left and went to Yellowstone instead of staying today. Here's some updates from him.

Hill climbs you drive more miles, pay less money, guaranteed payouts to all starters on race day, bigger payout to top 3, and get to spectate 800 horsepower open wheel cars.

Ironically I had a dream last night that I got my RA license revoked permanently for 'unprofessional behaviour' and just moved to the Czech Republic as a solution. Had another dream to where I asked Ken and Travis what the point was and why were they racing in the US where there result isn't nearly as impressive as if they were racing in PWRC or even in GB Group N championship, or better yet, full WRC. You know the money is there that they could be there. Look at all the small privateers with occasional showings this last year.

Oh, Mitch's rant, here it is. Sent on a cell phone so grammar and spelling isn't perfect.
"So we decided to withdrawl and head over to yellowstone national park
in the morning. Reason being, this has been the worst event for me ever. A
lot of people here are friggen pissed. Things have been to rediculous this
weekend I don't even know were to start. First of all all the stages have been
cancled. Which is no big deal, shit happens. However, organizers have
known about the high potential of canceling the stages since Monday. People
did not find out until Friday night. But this was not information that was
broadcasted by officials or posted at headquarters. Most teams had to find
out from other teams. The reason people couldn't find information like
this at headquarters is because there was really no headquarters at all. It
took us the entire day friday to find even registration. This is after
discovering that base was actually in a random closed door hotel room unmarked. On top of that, once we found the room, it wasn't full of officials, it was full
of a couple of kids eating sandwhiches.

So we find Registration and get over there. No infomation provided by
registration peronel, and no notes available even though we payed for
them.
Also, no suplemental orders regarding the cancled stages. So the
conclusion was (by most) that the new information (Master time, schedule and
everything else) would be provided at the opening "Dinner" Party.


The dinner party turned out to be an autograph session for Travis and
Pals (who where sat on a podium while the rest of the teams were forced to
stand). No information or greeting or nothing. All we got was "Show up at OVR
at 9". All information spread for was Via Grape vine and no formal postings
what so ever. By the way, there was no dinner.

Saturday we get there with a few mechanical problems (No BFD). Of
course the Sprint sucked serious horse shit and was something like 100 yard threw the trees and into a giant 4 achre mud pit deeper than the muddiest day at
core.
5 runs for the day with 30 minuet service between each run. No change
of course, no mixing it up, and ATCs, RGCs and MTCs all over the place
within a 100 yards. A total confusing cluster fuck of bull shit. I mean it was
horrible, not to mention no times in or out. So why not just line up
and screw all the other crap?

End of day, OK. Lets get together for the rally dinner. But no
posting as to were it was. Everyone, even RA officials had no idea where the fuck the thing was. Once agian, grapevine and a brilliant receptionist at the hotel who job was to run the hotel and not the rally. We get there in its this small at country bar (which had a mechanical bull by the way. curse my broken
leg). Travis had 8 reserved tables out of 16ish. The rest were taken up by
locals. We caught up with a few other teams who shared the same pissed off
feelings we did. We were forced to go out back to an unheated tent away from the bar and music which felt seriously like to storage cooler than part of the bar. We order dinner while troy stayed in the bar until he could score a table
(he did). I step out for a smoke (with open tab)and return to "do you have
a wrist band? If not, you need to pay $10 to stay or leave by 7:30.
Travis Pastrana will be here tonight (like I give a fuck)". After a quick
bitch fest to the owner, then a guilt ridden apolgy garnished with an explanation of our weekend, then some small bonding, he allowed us to stay.

At the bar there were several teams all pissed off. One guy brought 5
cars (big family I guess) and was about to cry. He stormed off. Another
team wasn't allowed in because most of them were under age and this was an
21 and over place. Keep in mind that everyone one came because they expected
information.

we talked with the volunteer captains who were deprived of information
just as much as everyone was. They didn't even know the stages were cancled
until friday night. They were pissed because they had provided hotel room to
a few poeple (reason unkown) that they were responsible to pay for.

It just went on and on and on and on. No appreciation for those who
made the efforts to come up. But a fucking reach around for the pros. We spent
a shit ton of money to come up here not to mention time and all sorts of
effort. I didn't have a good time and I spend 95% of the weekend pissed off. I
tried to give it a rest but shit just kept comming up. Very very very shitty
event and I won't ever run and event organized by these people. I'll explain a
little more when we get back into town.

After dinner tonight we decided to drop out and head to Yellowstone national park in the morning. We're all really excited about it because none of
have been there before and a huge load has been lifted off our chests."

---

Grant Hughes

OMFG -

Sounds worse then Reno, but I'll share more tomorrow.
I just towed 600 miles and I'm fucking tired from standing around and doing shit all day yesterday.

- Kris

(my god-damn first post bitches...)

Mitch

To Bad you didn't protest the competitiors who DNFed while wallowing in the sea of shit. The VW Golf which broke the throttle cable, and "the car that will change the face of US Rally" Honda or Toyota or whatever the fuck it was on the last "stage".
Both the cars should have been excluded and crew penalized.

Both DNFed and neither displayed their triangles, and neither displayed the OK sign.
Further you could have protested the following driversand get them excluded who by rules are required to stop if there is no OK sign shown and alert follow crews etc.
In fact every folllowing crew should be protested and excluded and fined.

If its going to be a farce, then make it a complete farce.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Marciniak !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's about fucking time you walked in to the DARK SIDE.

2 rallies same weekend, 2 fiascos, no no 2 SNAFUs, same sanctioning body. I saw this shit coming looooong ago, I voiced my opinion and got yelled at.

So what's the game plan, what do we do now ?

---

Cheers
M.Samli
Phoenix AZ
Gaylant VR4
EVO III GSR (Stolen)


Rallies are no place for traitors

"So what's the game plan, what do we do now ?"

Mexico, Canada, Europe. A friend of mine swears you can fly in, rent a car and run it in the UK for less than it costs to run your own car in the US.

I just ran a trouble free "Rally of the Tall Pines" with lots of stage miles and good organisation last weekend. And, I don't always take it for granted.

No one has control over the weather and other stuff DOES happen, but I am really glad that I didn't write checks and tow out for Reno or particularly WW!!!

I wasn't there, but it does sound like WW should have been cancelled and entry fees refunded.

Try not to do anything you will regret later. Which is exactly what I would do if I was really p*ssed off and started drinking!

Ted Mendham

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Ted Mendham
www.rensport.net

Rally Acapulco was a few weekends ago. $350 entry fee, 130+ stage miles, all tarmac.

Mexico has quite a few events. I've argued often that it'd be cheaper to buy a car in Europe and just pay for storage and fly out 6 times a year to race.

Or alternatively, buy a car in Europe and figure out a way to live there.

Rally in the US is only getting more expensive. And the country isn't getting smaller and gas isn't getting cheaper.

It will become more a rich man's sport and national championships will mean even less than they do now. Local and regional growth is going to have to be the solution. We talked once of rally clubs, where the club owns a six car hauler. Up to five cars and one service van on at a time. Monthly dues, plus per event rental costs. Share service, spares, hotels, fuel, etc.

Or underground rallying. Secret, unsanctioned, uninsured rally. Personal invite only. Roads with one in and one out so can easily be blocked on both ends.

---

Grant Hughes

Okay so - the organizer forgot the permits.
BLM shows up and is like - WTF?
They drive to get the permits.
By the time they get back the BLM realizes that the EMT's have no equipment.
A backboard is rushed out there... TOTALLY SAFE.

We sit at the start line for hours.

We start the rally.
We have an okay first stage - just getting settled in.
There's a quad off to the left and I damn well know that he's making his way out between rally traffic. He was stopped and off the road when we got to him - and I wasn't about to throw the stage for this ass hat. Christine notes that it's right by a HAM - and the ham did call it in.
That adds 10 min to everyone behind us.
But - hey - we're still rallying right?!

We get to SS2 and sweep hasn't even left yet.
Hours...
We hear that SS2 is - and has been - fucking impassable with 2WD cars all week.
Stage canceled.
Brian Scott gets out and 'decides' for the first 10 ppl that were going to run SS1 in reverse and go home. Dean in the Suzuki and I are like - um - NO - we came to a friggen rally here people.

Pat calls a meeting.
We then decided to just run the first stage back and forth.
Another hour goes by and finally cars get going.
I'm sitting behind Hollingsworth - ready to start.
10 seconds to spare a worker jumps if front of Craig and tells us there is civilian traffic on stage.
Craig and I are the first to transit the stage.

We get down to the hairpin "steer corner" and Christine is lazily reading the notes and announces that we missed it. Criag figures this out too and we turn around,
Where was the tape? Where was the fucking photog that was blocking the road on SS1?? Did they just hear on the radio to go home?? I see a Hummer transiting out the stage (workers) and I turn to Tine and announce: "We're fucking done."

Come to find out - there was no one blocking that road at all for that stage. Several competitors missed it (at speed), plus we had hunters on a hot stage. OMG if they had gone right instead of left there... There was tape - but that doesn't stop hunters.

Rally over.
We go back to the hotel.
I get no explanation of what the fuck happened.
I (at this point) still have never met Dave and I don't even know what he looks like.
We have 3 points races, 2 events, 5 co-effs, and ONE FUCKING STAGE!
How can anyone at this point say who is the better driver?

We then continue a CRS tradition at the bar.
Margarita time!
Sunday morning we show up at the breakfast looking for redemption.
We get a blank apology with no explanation / discussion.
They hand out trophies as if nothing has happened.
It looks as if they are doing the SAME with WW...

The anger kept me awake for the 9 hour tow home.
They are talking about a refund - we shall see.

- Kris









Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2006 02:48PM by webkris.

To echo Ted's post, I do think it's economically feasible to either purchase or rent a car in Mexico(and perhaps in Europe) and run a championship.

You can buy a Peugeot 206 Cup Car in Mexico for under $10K US ready to go. They have a series national series(tarmac and gravel events). My thought was that it would be reasonable for a couple guys to co-op a car and take turns flying in and runningn events. Uruguay and other South American countries have active rally series as well.

From the stories of this past weekend, I have a feeling the schedule will change next year. Having an event not run due to weather is not going to be acceptable in a national championship.

Cheers! John

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http://www.lastditchracing.com
http://www.triplecaution.us

Amen John.

It's not like the weather cought anybody by surprise.

One of my buddies from MD ran WRC Turkey in a Citroen and he spent almost what I spend at a regional rally. If anybody wants to take a stab at WRC Turkey 08 or ERC Turkey 07 I can put them in contact with proper parties overthere. Anything from a Club car to a S1600 to a WRC car is available.

In the meantime, what can we do to make it right here ?

---

Cheers
M.Samli
Phoenix AZ
Gaylant VR4
EVO III GSR (Stolen)


Rallies are no place for traitors

I think that sanctioning bodies will be putting event organizers on the spot, requiring contingency plans in writing for their review.

I also think that early or late season events will most likely have to be run where the weather is fairly stable or at least where adverse weather won't effect road usage.

Tall Pines is a great example. Run thanksgiving weekend each year. Could be ice, snow, gravel etc. Doesn't matter. It'll run no matter what.

I think we'll see more and more folks travelling to rally. The adventure is a huge draw for those of us who've rallied in NA for some time.

I wouldn't mind visiting Turkey again... :-)

Cheers! John

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http://www.lastditchracing.com
http://www.triplecaution.us

sagsert Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In the meantime, what can we do to make it right
> here ?


i say follow the french and have a REAL FFSA type of organization. they got 70,000 members at mucho levels of life. they're like fight club of autosports..... everywhere you go they're there. they have a great, STRUCTURED, organization with volunteers and people who are passionate about what they do. most dont get paid and yet do a better job than people who do get paid to put together sport events. because there is a passion for it when people become less involved in autosports and more into their carrere they still contribute to the FFSA. they also have celebrities participate in some series (thinking about the yaris series) and they make damn sure they get their sports into the media too.
or the interesting rally championship in switzerland. that's a demonstration in quality and organization like no one else. http://www.swissrally.ch/ they have a fun and competitive championship with great locations but the only thing that is a minus is that they have to keep all cars under 100db. but that is also a plus according to a friend in the Valais region cause teams from other countries dont pass the test and leave my swiss friends alone!


but here, it's just too damn big! too many egos, too little passion and even the ones who are fans dont seem to get along. the one thing that is needed is organisation and an end to ra/nasa/usrc/scca and have one organisation with diferent events, coeficients based on wether the event is local or national and a final that changes location every year. but there are too few competitors for this model, or maybe there are too few because this model is not what's happening now? either way, when it's all said and done, i would really doubt that rallying in europe costs less than here unless you are renting a second rate vehicle.

My issue with NA rallying has always been the sheer scale of the geography to be covered. To race the Rally America championship would be impossible for us. We just couldn't afford the travel.

Countries like Mexico, France, GB etc have a series where you can attend an event with relatively minimal travel, good infrastructure of organizers/volunteers etc.

If we could do that regionally in the US and convice people that it's OK to race regionally instead of over-extending themselves to travel across the country multiple times in a year, then we'd be on to something.

We race mostly Eastern canadian events because 4 of them are all under 13 hours from my house and the organization and competition are first class.

We had a blast in the spec Peugeot at Corona Rally Mexico and I'd race in an affordable spec series anyday(Yaris perhaps?)! :-)

Cheers! John

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http://www.lastditchracing.com
http://www.triplecaution.us

I say if you want to insure that you have a fair chance at having a good event, look at running events with a good track record. Or, at least only consider spending your time and money at new events which are organized by experienced people who you trust.

STPR has been run regularly since the 70s. They try to maintain a good relationship with the headquarter town of Wellsboro, PA. Tall Pines and Perce-Neige, running regularly for roughly 37 and 40 years. I know these are Eastern events, but I use them as examples because I am familiar with them. You can expect better organisation and you will have a better chance of getting some stage mileage than at some event which was pulled together (maybe) at the last minute.

Wasn't Reno pulled from the RA Nat. Championship schedule mid-season in favor of Wild West? Didn't someone at RA already get worried about Reno enough to make a late decision to pull it? I don't run out West, but that raised a red flag for me.

Rally Organisors are first and foremost promoters. They have to tell a lot of people a lot of things they want to hear to have a remote chance of pulling off an event. Some have a better track record of providing value to competitors than others.

It is tough. When you send in your entry for a regional event in the NorthEast US, you don't know what you going to get, either. Maybe a complete last minute cancellation (spring Black River), the many interesting stories of the Rally NY series or the last minute stage road changes at Rally-O'Neil.

Ted Mendham

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Ted Mendham
www.rensport.net

To be fair Wild West has been run for many many years, but the enviroment changes and somepeople do not realise they have a new set of problems till the problem kicks
their ass.

I ran the event last year and it was fantastic, some very fun roads, on time, good comunications, clear instrucitons etc.

D

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In the long run reality always wins.