anyone ever shoot a taurus "judge"

im thinking about eventually buying a revolver for conceal and carry once i get some of this rally car done. Curious if anyone has shot the taurus Judge at all. The one i am looking at is the "public defender" which has the 2-1/2 chamber for .410 or .45 colt. Any input would be great.

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First Rally: 2010 First RallyX: 2004 (a bunch)
Driver (0), Co-Driver (7)
Organizer (3), Volunteer (3)
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Last Updated, Apr 9, 2023

Never had the need for a weapon and I've lived in some pretty seedy places.
Can't help you.

Realistically, you probably don't need a concealed weapon either.
If you don't have it out and aimed, it's too late so it's obvious it has severe drawbacks as a defensive weapon.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

john vanlandingham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Never had the need for a weapon and I've lived in
> some pretty seedy places.
> Can't help you.
>
> Realistically, you probably don't need a concealed
> weapon either.
> If you don't have it out and aimed, it's too late
> so it's obvious it has severe drawbacks as a
> defensive weapon.
>
John, you might want to cut back on the JVL sweetarts ...
>
> John Vanlandingham
> Sleezattle, WA, USA
>
> Vive le Prole-le-ralliat
>
> www.rallyrace.net/jvab
> CALL +1 206 431-9696
> Remember! Pacific Standard Time
> is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

---

As always IMHO

SEAN TENNIS KF7JJR
SEATTLE, WASHINGTON
SAAB 99, SAAB 850
SAAB V4, SAAB 99T

Taurus has always been kind of a '2nd string' gun.

Check out this thread http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=32516 The .410 is a waste of time against people. You really don't want to be the guy with a 10 foot range when the
"gangstas" are packing Glocks and better.

Maybe look at a S&W Chiefs Special. Using .38+P is a good choice. Revolvers are nice in the fact they rarely jam or misfire but if carrying under clothing the exposed hammer can be a serious issue.

A 5 shot is desired for the thinner profile under clothing.The larger shell may remove some of that benefit. I would compare the .45 Taurus to a conventional 6 shot .38/357 and see if it is that much smaller.

Go find a gun range that rents one. They seem kinda bulky for CC. I haven't tried one out so can't say anything about how they handle. Lots of folks get too big and bulky a gun for this application, and it turns out, a small .380 in a IWB holster is worth much more than a 4 lb .45 in your safe at home, should the need arise.

Years ago I ran a few mags through a friends' HK 9mm part-plastic wundernine, and although it was cool as all getout, I'd never ever buy one. The recoil was so short and sharp that it hurt the socket between my thumb and wrist. Surprising, outta a measly 9mm, and unlike either of the others I've used...I'd shoot .44 mag all day and not get sore from it but I was done with that HK after a few minutes. Since then, all my shootin' irons have been bought after trying one out first.

Oh and if you're going to commit to not being a victim, and props to you for so deciding, read up on current gun law (packing.org is helpful), read "in the gravest extreme" by Massad Ayoob, and PRACTICE. Lots. Consider the time money and effort to be an insurance policy, as it is far better to have and not need than the other way round.

---

Jay Woodward
Snohomish, WA
'90 Mazdog Frankenprotege
Chronologically, 46...

tooled around the gun store today, i think i might opt for a 5 shot .357mag snub with concealed hammer.

---

First Rally: 2010 First RallyX: 2004 (a bunch)
Driver (0), Co-Driver (7)
Organizer (3), Volunteer (3)
Cars Built (2.5), Engines Blown (2) Cages Built (0) # of rotations (3.5)
Last Updated, Apr 9, 2023

John, somewhere, I think youtube, there is a video of a watch store owner who kept getting robbed, at gunpoint. He got fed up with it. He purchased a pistol. ONe day, he, they attempted to rob him again. Gun in his face, he picked the gun off the desk, and shot him, and I think killed that particular person. He lived, and did not get robbed that day. He then purchased a few more guns, and spread them about his workbench. They tried to rob him about 4 more times, If I remember right, and every time he shot one of them, without have the gun drawn first, gun already in his face.


It IS possible to win without already having it drawn and aimed. It happens all the time. You just don't hear about it, as its completely legal.

And thats all I'm going to say, as while I would love an MP40 or MP9 for target shooting, I don't really plan on carrying.

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Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> John, somewhere, I think youtube, there is a video
> of a watch store owner who kept getting robbed, at
> gunpoint. He got fed up with it. He purchased a
> pistol. ONe day, he, they attempted to rob him
> again. Gun in his face, he picked the gun off the
> desk, and shot him, and I think killed that
> particular person. He lived, and did not get
> robbed that day. He then purchased a few more
> guns, and spread them about his workbench. They
> tried to rob him about 4 more times, If I remember
> right, and every time he shot one of them, without
> have the gun drawn first, gun already in his face.
>
>
>
> It IS possible to win without already having it
> drawn and aimed. It happens all the time. You just
> don't hear about it, as its completely legal.
>
> And thats all I'm going to say, as while I would
> love an MP40 or MP9 for target shooting, I don't
> really plan on carrying.
>
> Feisty Peacock?
>
>


In the late 80s i read in some trade magazine about the problem auto repair joints in the NE were having getting robbed since they were easy targets and had LOTS of CASH---since nobody in the NE trusts anybodys checks since so many people were so often putting stop payments and bouncing checks etc. that many places went to CASH ONLY policy.
The study reported that in a 2 year period that they dug as hard as they could, that the % of store owners who tried to defend themselves against armed robbers who ended up being killed was over 85%.

Statistically, that seems like a bad bet, and that guns work BEST, MOST of the time only as offensive weapons...

It's all a big fantasy for 99.9% of people anyway that the "need" a weapon.

Maybe I just got it all out of my system by time I was 14 since we'd be out EVERYDAY blazing away 50-100 rounds for months on end.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

I used to use the Taurus Raging Bull a lot. Totally short range, kinda bulky, and not that great of a gun.

Oh yeah, this was in the video game Rainbow Six, not in real life.

--sarge

---

---** To be in compliance with the Anarchy **---
Jorden R. Kleier
Baraboo, Wisconsin, USA
1990 Mazdog Protege 4WD
1973

I think gun use, as a defensive solution, needs to be instintive. Rally driving needs to be instinctive. Both require an instantaneous and accurate response. You need to be able to pull and shoot with deadly accuracy. Not thinking, no second thoughts and of course you have to be able to actually hit the target. No wounding. Then you have to be able to live with the mental after effects. I have 3 cop friends that have killed people. 2 retired not long after, the other made it a few years. Deadly force seems to have some repercussions for some people.

SgtRauksauff Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I used to use the Taurus Raging Bull a lot.
> Totally short range, kinda bulky, and not that
> great of a gun.
>
> Oh yeah, this was in the video game Rainbow Six,
> not in real life.
>
> --sarge
>
> ---** To be in compliance with the Anarchy **---
> Jorden R. Kleier
> Baraboo, Wisconsin, USA
> 1990 Mazdog Protege 4WD
> 1973


I am nominating this for post of the year.

heymagic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think gun use, as a defensive solution, needs to
> be instintive. Rally driving needs to be
> instinctive. Both require an instantaneous and
> accurate response. You need to be able to pull and
> shoot with deadly accuracy. Not thinking, no
> second thoughts and of course you have to be able
> to actually hit the target. No wounding. Then you
> have to be able to live with the mental after
> effects. I have 3 cop friends that have killed
> people. 2 retired not long after, the other made
> it a few years. Deadly force seems to have some
> repercussions for some people.

Yep.
Assholes talking about how they's "waste' (fill in the blank of whatever minority somebody convinced you to hate)____________________________ing mutherfawkers" coming screeching up against the hard reality that most even half-way mentally stable people are not going to cope with the repercussions of killing another human.
I'd suggest that if a person is so out of touch with reality to think they "need" to run around armed and "ready till kill" people then they are not quite all that connected with reality and that the horror of actually killing somebody is going to push them over some edge, and it won't be pretty.

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Nobody is gonna change anybody's mind here, specially seeing's how this thread started off as a which gun advice question. I could go on but why.... don't judge me and I won't judge you, howzat?

---

Jay Woodward
Snohomish, WA
'90 Mazdog Frankenprotege
Chronologically, 46...

John, check your meds ...

---

As always IMHO

SEAN TENNIS KF7JJR
SEATTLE, WASHINGTON
SAAB 99, SAAB 850
SAAB V4, SAAB 99T

Jay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nobody is gonna change anybody's mind here,
> specially seeing's how this thread started off as
> a which gun advice question. I could go on but
> why.... don't judge me and I won't judge you,
> howzat?
>
Agreed that nobody will ever change anybody's mind, and that is part of the problem we face as a country. basic irrationality is so ingrained and reinforced in our culture that it merits whole essays and books have been written on how fear is manufactured, and perpetuated and persists regardless of documentable facts to the contrary.
A serious essay written in 1964 lays out the problem which has only become worse in the intervening years:

The Paranoid Style in American Politics
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Jump to: navigation, search
Q

The Paranoid Style in American Politics[1] is an essay by the American historian Richard J. Hofstadter, first published in Harper's magazine in November 1964. Written at a time when Senator Barry Goldwater had won the Republican Presidential nomination over the more moderate Nelson A. Rockefeller, Hofstadter's article explores the influence of conspiracy theory and "movements of suspicious discontent" throughout American history.
Contents
[hide]

* 1 Themes
o 1.1 The paranoid style as a recurring theme in American political history
o 1.2 The paranoid style defined
o 1.3 The Enemy Reified
o 1.4 Emulating the enemy
* 2 Reviews
* 3 See also
* 4 References

[edit] Themes
[edit] The paranoid style as a recurring theme in American political history

Hofstadter begins by noting that:

American politics has often been an arena for angry minds. In recent years we have seen angry minds at work mainly among extreme right-wingers, who have now demonstrated in the Goldwater movement how much political leverage can be got out of the animosities and passions of a small minority. But behind this I believe there is a style of mind that is far from new and that is not necessarily right-wing. I call it the paranoid style simply because no other word adequately evokes the sense of heated exaggeration, suspiciousness, and conspiratorial fantasy that I have in mind.[1]

Hofstadter goes on to detail historical paranoia directed against Illuminism, Freemasonry, and the Jesuits, and follows this strain in American politics through what he considered its modern incarnations in McCarthyism and the activities of the John Birch Society.
[edit] The paranoid style defined

Hofstadter describes the unifying characteristics of the paranoid politician thus:

The paranoid spokesman sees the fate of conspiracy in apocalyptic terms — he traffics in the birth and death of whole worlds, whole political orders, whole systems of human values. He is always manning the barricades of civilization... he does not see social conflict as something to be mediated and compromised, in the manner of the working politician. Since what is at stake is always a conflict between absolute good and absolute evil, what is necessary is not compromise but the will to fight things out to a finish. Since the enemy is thought of as being totally evil and totally unappeasable, he must be totally eliminated — if not from the world, at least from the theatre of operations to which the paranoid directs his attention. This demand for total triumph leads to the formulation of hopelessly unrealistic goals, and since these goals are not even remotely attainable, failure constantly heightens the paranoid’s sense of frustration. Even partial success leaves him with the same feeling of powerlessness with which he began, and this in turn only strengthens his awareness of the vast and terrifying quality of the enemy he opposes.[1]

[edit] The Enemy Reified

Perhaps the most trenchant part of his essay is the descriptive phrase of how the enemy is thought to act, the description of that personality:

The enemy is clearly delineated: he is a perfect model of malice, a kind of amoral superman—sinister, ubiquitous, powerful, cruel, sensual, luxury-loving. Unlike the rest of us, the enemy is not caught in the toils of the vast mechanism of history, himself a victim of his past, his desires, his limitations. He wills, indeed he manufactures, the mechanism of history, or tries to deflect the normal course of history in an evil way. He makes crises, starts runs on banks, causes depressions, manufactures disasters, and then enjoys and profits from the misery he has produced. The paranoid’s interpretation of history is distinctly personal: decisive events are not taken as part of the stream of history, but as the consequences of someone’s will. Very often the enemy is held to possess some especially effective source of power: he controls the press; he has unlimited funds; he has a new secret for influencing the mind (brainwashing); he has a special technique for seduction (the Catholic confessional).[1]

[edit] Emulating the enemy

Hofstadter also notes the element of psychological projection inherent in the paranoid style of politics. That is,

It is hard to resist the conclusion that this enemy is on many counts the projection of the self; both the ideal and the unacceptable aspects of the self are attributed to him. The enemy may be the cosmopolitan intellectual, but the paranoid will outdo him in the apparatus of scholarship, even of pedantry. Secret organizations set up to combat secret organizations give the same flattery. The Ku Klux Klan imitated Catholicism to the point of donning priestly vestments, developing an elaborate ritual and an equally elaborate hierarchy. The John Birch Society emulates Communist cells and quasi-secret operation through "front" groups, and preaches a ruthless prosecution of the ideological war along lines very similar to those it finds in the Communist enemy. Spokesmen of the various fundamentalist anti-Communist "crusades" openly express their admiration for the dedication and discipline the Communist cause calls forth.[1]

The article also notes that "sexual freedom" is a vice often attributed to the paranoid politician's enemy, and notes that "very often the fantasies of true believers reveal strong sadomasochistic outlets, vividly expressed, for example, in the delight of anti-Masons with the cruelty of Masonic punishments."
[edit] Reviews

In an August 2007 article, Scott Horton wrote that The Paranoid Style in American Politics was "one of the most important and most influential articles published in the 155 year history of the magazine

Full essay here:
http://karws.gso.uri.edu/jfk/conspiracy_theory/the_paranoid_mentality/the_paranoid_style.html

Look out! there's another ________________________ behind that bush gonna get you!




>
>
>
>
> Jay Woodward
> Snohomish, WA
> '90 Mazdog Frankenprotege
> Chronologically, 40...

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.