DirtyImpretzel is at it again!



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In this episode of the DirtyImpreza.com Project Rally RS build we cover the events from much of 2008. The 2001 Subaru Impreza 2.5RS was stripped down, seam welded, caged, painted, and re-assembled with a donor motor and transmission from another 2001 2.5RS.

Big thanks goes out to everyone who helped out this year with the car.

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-Aaron
http://www.dirtyimpreza.com

Car looks bad ass, Aaron. I am totally jealous of your progress.

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Brian Driggs | KG7KCA | PHX, AZ | 89 Pajero
alterius non sit qui suus esse potest

I don't see gussets in the roof X and the rest of the gussets don't have inspection holes or the 1/2 moon notch at the inner junction. If you look at the FIA drawings the gussets have 1/2 moon notches on the inner V. How is someone supposed to inspect the welds if you can't see them?

Look at some of the other welds/projects this guy has done. I challenge you to find a better rollcage welder. EVERY weld looks like a stack of dimes.

gilbrock Wrote:
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> Look at some of the other welds/projects this guy
> has done. I challenge you to find a better
> rollcage welder. EVERY weld looks like a stack of
> dimes.

Flat doesn't matter does it ? Every cage, every weld has to be inspected before log booking. We don't just say "so and so welds good" so we don't need to look at it. I've seen some of the best pros around miss a weld or forget a needed bar.

Hands down, that's the most work I have seen in four minutes ever! Very nice.

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Boost early and Boost often

heymagic Wrote:
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> I don't see gussets in the roof X and the rest of
> the gussets don't have inspection holes or the 1/2
> moon notch at the inner junction. If you look at
> the FIA drawings the gussets have 1/2 moon notches
> on the inner V. How is someone supposed to inspect
> the welds if you can't see them?


uh-oh....

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Jon Burke - KI6LSW
Blog: http://psgrallywrx.blogspot.com/

no sweat, you have a drill, right? Rotabroach sheet metal bits are available at good welding stores, and work so well drilling inspection holes would be fun.

heymagic Wrote:
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> I don't see gussets in the roof X and the rest of
> the gussets don't have inspection holes or the 1/2
> moon notch at the inner junction. If you look at
> the FIA drawings the gussets have 1/2 moon notches
> on the inner V. How is someone supposed to inspect
> the welds if you can't see them?

The exact same gussets were used on another car that was log booked recently. I wasn't aware that this was going to be a problem. We can drill holes if necessary for inspection.

Thanks for the tip.

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-Aaron
http://www.dirtyimpreza.com

Yes I have seen a cage or two logbooked with similar gussets. It is an issue that is being discussed amoung scrutineers. If you could drill a hole or two I'm sure it would be appreciated.

heymagic Wrote:
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> Yes I have seen a cage or two logbooked with
> similar gussets. It is an issue that is being
> discussed amoung scrutineers. If you could drill a
> hole or two I'm sure it would be appreciated.


Gene,

I don't think Dave made any holes in my gussets, so I'll need to drill some before you look at it. Do you have an example picture of what you will need?

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-Jason

'there's a hole in my gussett, dear liza, dear liza'

'there's a hole in my gussett, dear liza, a hole'

'then inspect it, dear henry, dear henry, dear henry'

'then inspect it, dear henry, dear henry, inspect it'





yes, i'm bored at work.

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Jon Burke - KI6LSW
Blog: http://psgrallywrx.blogspot.com/

Jon Burke Wrote:
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> 'there's a hole in my gussett, dear liza, dear
> liza'
>
> 'there's a hole in my gussett, dear liza, a hole'
>
> 'then inspect it, dear henry, dear henry, dear
> henry'
>
> 'then inspect it, dear henry, dear henry, inspect
> it'
>
>
>
>
>
> yes, i'm bored at work.
>
> Jon Burke - KI6LSW
> Blog:
> 'Holy Shit!' @ 4:10


Frickin hilarious !

If a person could mebbe drill a 3/4 hole in at least one side of the gusset that should be adequate.

Did I miss somewhere in the FIA rules where it says there must be holes in the gussets for the welds to be inspected? Because I don't remember seeing that. Could someone maybe quote that rule or post a link, please? I'm not trying to be an asshat, I just wanna know if I missed something because this is the first I've heard of it. Maybe it's a new rule I haven't seen yet.
In the case of X style door bars made with two V bars (as opposed to intersecting bars) I think it's a bad idea to have holes because the only thing holding the two bars together in a side impact is the gusset. There is not enough weld contact between where the two bends meet alone to hold them together. Mike Hurst likes to go on about how Nascar style doorbars are bad because if you hit a tree sideways the bars will bend far into the cockpit until they are in tension. He wants a bar to be in tension to prevent this. Yet he favors the two V bent bars for the X style door bars. These are not in tension! They will bend even farther into the cockpit in a side impact with a tree! You are completely relying on the gusset to hold those two bars together. That's why the gussets I use on that style of door bar are the same thickness as the tubing and have no holes. If you look at other cages I have done with intersecting tubes I have used thinner gussets with nice dimpled holes. And if you think I'm hiding unwelded tubes underneath closed gussets then I just don't know what to say.

Doivi Clarkinen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Did I miss somewhere in the FIA rules where it
> says there must be holes in the gussets for the
> welds to be inspected? Because I don't remember
> seeing that. Could someone maybe quote that rule
> or post a link, please? I'm not trying to be an
> asshat, I just wanna know if I missed something
> because this is the first I've heard of it. Maybe
> it's a new rule I haven't seen yet.
> In the case of X style door bars made with two V
> bars (as opposed to intersecting bars) I think
> it's a bad idea to have holes because the only
> thing holding the two bars together in a side
> impact is the gusset. There is not enough weld
> contact between where the two bends meet alone to
> hold them together. Mike Hurst likes to go on
> about how Nascar style doorbars are bad because if
> you hit a tree sideways the bars will bend far
> into the cockpit until they are in tension. He
> wants a bar to be in tension to prevent this. Yet
> he favors the two V bent bars for the X style door
> bars. These are not in tension! They will bend
> even farther into the cockpit in a side impact
> with a tree! You are completely relying on the
> gusset to hold those two bars together. That's
> why the gussets I use on that style of door bar
> are the same thickness as the tubing and have no
> holes. If you look at other cages I have done
> with intersecting tubes I have used thinner
> gussets with nice dimpled holes. And if you think
> I'm hiding unwelded tubes underneath closed
> gussets then I just don't know what to say.

Well Dave it isn't just about you There are lots of people doing cages and adding gussets and no one is accusing anyone of hiding anything. If you look at the picture of an FIA gusset it clearly shows the C notch on the inner corner. I don't think you can expect scrutineers to keep certifying cages and welds when they can't see the welds. I know your welds are fine, I know my welds are fine. I booted 2 cages last year for incomplete welds however. A hole drilled in one side of a gusset or a Cnotch or the way cool stamped/beveled holes all allow welds to be checked somewhat. This whole concept is being discussed by all sanctioning bodies to some degree. I wouldn't be surprised if the rules are clarified to include this concept. Then again it may just blow over, I don't know. Be awful easy to drill an inspection hole though. I see a thread in the Canadian SS just started http://www.specialstage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35133