onboard fire suppression

Yeah. I'm thinking halon though. That way, when you get sprayed, its not like being shot by a super soaker.

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Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Wasn't the production of Halon banned in 1994 (or so?)

It's my understanding that the production of Halon was banned and that only re-cycled Halon was permitted to be used.

The Colt had Halon extinguishers in it when I bought it. The tags were expired and I couldn't get anyone to re-certify them.

So I swapped them for non Halon ones.

Oooh, I thought it was halon was banned, and you're just allowed to use up the current halon supply. I didnt know it would need to be re certified.

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Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

The 2009 CARS rulebook section that deals with Fire Extinguishers states :

1 fire extinguisher with a minimum UL rating of 10 BC or 2 with a minimum rating of 5 BC.

It also says...

It is strongly recommended that Halon or other similar gaseous extinguishat be used.

Then this :

Evidence must be produced that the fire extinguisher has been purchased or recharged within the preceeding 2 years.

So according to this... Halon is legal and according to the EPA it is legal to use "re-cycled Halon".

http://www.epa.gov/Ozone/snap/fire/qa.html

Hmmmm... seems that you just need to find a place that has re-cycled Halon that will fill a few bottles.

Or simply forget about using Halon.

Out of curiosity :

How many people reading this are using Halon ?

Personally I opted for 2 - 10 BC's (a little more weight, but so what !)

May be easier to just go the conventional route though.

I still think its better to point the nozzles at the possible ignition sources.
If the flames are big enough that I'm going to catch on fire I'd be more likely to be trying to get out so I can stop drop and roll or something.

mack73 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Although what if you are on fire- how hard is it
> to try to find the extinguisher, aim at yourself
> and then sqeeze vs. Pulling the handle?
>
> 94 Golf
> www.Mack73.com

meh, 2 handhelds. If that doesn't put it out you've got bigger problems.

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Gone fishing

Yeah, that's actually what I've decided. I was talking to Charles at safedrives (as he has more car fire exp then I do ) and he was saying he had no problems with the handhelds.

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Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

In rally, 90% of the time your fire extinguishers will be used to help out your friends.

Unless you have a plumbed in system, when 90% of the time you'll have to shrug your shoulders and watch your friend's car burn.

Will a plumbed in system do a better job of putting out a fire in your car? Uh, maybe. I haven't seen any data on it. I don't doubt that a mega system _could_, especially with cubic dollars behind it, but better payback (as far as car repair costs) for that money would probably be driving school. Plus way more fun.

Anders

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Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.

And keep in mind that the vast, vast majority of rally cars start in the engine compartment (like maybe 95% or more?). Concentrate your fire suppression resources in that area.

These fires very often start in a roll, where the motor breaks parrtially loose, and flops around and tears apart oil cooler and PS pump and fuel lines, that spray flammable liquids on hot things. So IMO, the first, and economical, investments in fire prevention in rally cars is to:
- Make sure motor and trannie mounts are good and new (I even used to add SS cables across my Opel motor mounts to hold the eninge in place in case the mounts broke in a wreck)
- Install all flammable liquid lines with plenty of slack where they route from the innner fenders or firewall to the engine
- Keep all liquids lines well supported and secured and away from vobrating engine parts and any edges that can chafe or cut them; there is no excuse to have loose lines in a rally car engine compartment
- Inpsect all lines regularly for chafing, cuts, and loose supports

And for fuel lines and cells, most simple rally car builders (or maybe I should state it as 'builders of simple rally cars') are actually doing themselves a favor to stay with the stock tank and lines initially. There are plenty of ways to do poor fuel cell installations......and I've done most of them!

Good luck!
Mark B.

You can still get Halon fire systems. I have one in my car, as well as a largeish Halon handheld.

Mine is a Safecraft with a nozzle right back near the turbo under the hood, one inside between the occupants and the fuel cell, and one up in the middle of the firewall, but on the cockpit side...right behind the turbo drain, but inside. Not sayin' that's the safest setup, but it's what I figured would be reasonable. Open to others' insight.

http://www.safecraft.com/

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Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2009 05:49PM by Lurch.

starion887 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> These fires very often start in a roll, where the
> motor breaks partially loose, and flops around
> and tears apart oil cooler and PS pump and fuel
> lines, that spray flammable liquids on hot things.
> So IMO, the first, and economical, investments in
> fire prevention in rally cars is to:
> - Make sure motor and trannie mounts are good and
> new (I even used to add SS cables across my Opel
> motor mounts to hold the eninge in place in case
> the mounts broke in a wreck)

I'll add to this that additional engine mounts are a very good idea where it can be done.

In my car Dave Clark made use of Volvo 240 rear suspension upper arms cut to length with standard rubber bushings connecting brackets made for the valve covers and the engine compartment forward of the strut towers.

Prior to doing this I was breaking engine mounts every time the car went out.... practicing or rallying.

I'm glad to not ever have been visited by fire in the rallycar.

Prevention!

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JohnLane

Overkill is consistently more fun

Firecharger brand AFF foam, or u can get ESS that has the FIA rating same systems.