So this idea started from a post over there in the Max Attack thread. Someone was talking about building a Civic and how there'd probably be a bunch of development work because they hadn't been rallied over here as prevalantly as the Golf has. I made the speculation that worldwide there's been more Civic rally cars than Golf rally cars, but you just might have to seach elsewhere. Then the idea that a thread about how to go about doing that on the internet might be useful.

1. Rally classifieds. My favorite are rallycarsforsale.net, ralli.net, rally.ie but I'm sure there are others. Find the model of car you're considering. Look at the specs. Keep your eye out for team websites either on page or on the actual car where they might have more pics and/or specs.

2. The Googles. Google.fi, etc. You may have to deduce which option is for "Only from the homeland" type of thing.

Anyhow, that's where I start. It's not going to be spoon fed to you like building a Subaru or a Golf will be though. And you'll quickly find out how much cooler most of the rally cars are overseas compared to ones in the US.

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Grant Hughes

I thought there was/is a guy on here. He was local anyways that had a rally civic. He used to come over to NWSR and stir up sheet. Most of them are fairly light, so that's a start... Good aftermarket for at least a motor build. I'm guessing all the suspension stuff is made for road race weenie boys at best. Whatever floats your boat...er auto.

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Name: Dawud Jackson (DJ)
Age: 30
Location: Seattle, WA
Occupation: Computer dude.

Civic there's also DMS, Proflex, and JVAB that are all rally spec.

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Grant Hughes

http://www.printsport.fi/
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The Boss, Eero Räikkönen, in an ex Finnish Champ in Honda Civic. He did most of the Honda development and is still Mr Honda overthere although it's mostly Mitsu EVO X now. They do top notch prep work. Expensive, ofcourse!
Check out their photo page. Nice shots.

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- RWD rocks -

I was also considering building one of them civics. It was gonna be one of them they rally in finland (minus the type R) 01-05 hatchback. Everyone in the US assumes that they need development but if you look at them overseas in group N3 trim there is a whole lot more than people think. Group N parts are expensive but who cares, we are in NA and dont have to worry bout homologation. Last weekend I sat in Cosworths RSX Type S rally car and shit was awesome. Stock motor, JVAB suspension and good gearbox setup. Knowing myself, i know i will build one sooner or later

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rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!!

There is probably no modern power plant that has more R&D than Honda. It is the equivalent of the small block Chevy 20 years ago. I just put a clutch in a '93 Accord with 296k on the clock. I service one that is past 400k and the car is still solid. They don't trash out much with age.


Should be a great rally car. Look at what Havas accomplished with the rental Civic here in the NW the last couple Oregon Trails. It has a B1800 with a header. Doesn't sound like it's cammed way up or or super hi-tech.

What was guy's name from up there that wrote off his car at 100AW in 04? Stephen Perrier or something like that. That car was really cool!

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Grant Hughes

As I am building a 97 Civic(EK) now, I can tell you that the suspension piece that will take some careful development is the rear trailing arm. I have seen stub axles rip out and the best solution that Honda rally guys have found is to replace the trailing arms with new ones every season. But, I will look more into that solution. Suspension travel front and rear is very good. Neil Wearden did very well with a 1.6L EK(won) in the British rally championship in the late 90s.

The later Civic(EP3), seen on the Finnish site, is very popular now because it already comes with a 2.0 liter motor. But, the earlier car is much lighter(300 lbs in stock form), and because of the ingenuity of american kids, it is easy to make impressive torque and power with motor swaps. Here in the US where our rules allow motor swaps it is a difficult choice between the 2 cars. Rally gear and final drive selection is unaparalleled.

My current trackday motor(which is not the one going in the rally car) has a DOHC VTEC head mated to a reinforced, balanced and carefully built 2.0 liter block from a CRV. I have used it for a few years in 2 cars, and makes 218hp( at the wheels on 91 Octane) and about 170 torque. Revs to 8100. At 2500 RPM it puts down 140 lb-ft torque, so the torque band is very wide. But, these motors are not for the budget people. Instead they offer race motor performance with normal reliability. Come to think about it, my motor probably has around 245 crank hp, only 40 or so less than an IRC S2000 but with a much wider powerband !

Onwards with this fun project.
George

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Civic Rally Car

http://mattjohnstonrally.com/a-complete-story/

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Kirk Coughlin
Woodbury, MN and River Falls, WI

Quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est.

I rallycross a '96 civic with an Integra powertrain swap (GSR DOHC VTEC cylinder head on a non-VTEC 1.8L short block, and a close ratio trans from a DelSol 1.6L VTEC). Surely not the same sort of abuse as rally, but it seems to be pretty stout for my uses.

The only problems I have encountered are replacing rear wheel bearings yearly as they get sloppy, and stock halfshafts dying pretty regularly. Luckily autozone has a lifetime warranty on rebuilt halfshafts, so I just keep replacing them for free. Heavy duty halfshafts are available for drag racing, but are pricey. Not sure if they would work for applying large torques at large steering angles like required in rally.

I really don't know why more people don't rally civics. They are in every junkyard in the country, Engine parts are plentiful and cheap, transmissions are already pretty close ratio with decent final drives and aftermaket gears are relatively cheap as well. It's really easy to make power, N/A or turbo. Suspension has decent travel, Light and rigid body shell, etc.

The main problem about civics is they steal em!

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rally gods would turn in their graves if they ever knew Lada's were now part of EU rallying!!!

Well, since I'm the one who poked the idea of a Civic rally car, I'll chime in. I know that there are European rally cars out there, but it's not as easy as coming to the forums and asking for help. Evan in his ITR, Matt in his Turbo Integra and Jon with his civic is about all the close to home info I can get.

the VW's are great cars, I just think they're a bit dated. I'm still on the hunt for a Honda shell on the cheap, but I'm pretty sure that's the next path I'm taking.

But Grant's made a suggestion that I've considered, and that's selling the STI to fund the rally budget.

BillyElliot Wrote:
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> But Grant's made a suggestion that I've
> considered, and that's selling the STI to fund the
> rally budget.


You know how many times I've had kids in sti's come up to me and say, "man, I sure wish I could afford to rally."? Lots. Enough that now when that happens I just shut my mouth and walk away.

Get a daily driver version of whatever your rally car is, then you have lots of spares just in case.

If you get very far into this rally thing you will end up selling it. Unless you're one of the types where budget isn't really your concern, you will end up with an inexpensive daily driver. It doesn't have to be a boring car, but it also doesn't need to cost you $500 per month to own.
There's plenty of examples of STI owners who have built rally cars and got rid of their STI for something more practical. Hey, maybe even your tow vehicle can be your daily driver. I prefer to have something that's still fun to drive. Starlet, Golf, GC8 Impreza all fit this.
Yeah there's not as much spoon feeding for a car that's not a Subaru or Golf, but all the theory is the same and all the information is out there. Suspension stuff you want strong, reliable, and adjustable (camber, caster, toe). Engine you want good torque and power and reliability, steering you want quick ratios, gearbox you want close ratios, low final drive, and clutch LSD. Brakes, well brakes are easy and anyone with a little time can figure out a decent brake setup and dual masters.

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Grant Hughes

I agree with Grant. Once you can feed your rally addiction with a proper car, the daily driver isn't that important anymore.

Robert.

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Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.