Hello everyone,

I'm new to the rally community however been a dreamer for a long time. I originally bought this 88 audi 80 for rallyx use, but that is not fast enough. I will be helping coordinate service areas for rally idaho and hope to meet some of you out there.

Now after talking to JVL (Jon I will have to call you back next week, my parents are visiting this weekend and the wife is fit for blown gasket) I have some questions as to my choice of car to build.

My intentions are to run max attack/some form of open 2wd (grp 5?).
Here is the plan
10v turbo motor has been purchased along with many many spare parts (radiators, oil coolers etc)
Weld center diff, locking rear diff and 4.11 ratio.
Drop front driveshafts/seal outputs and run rwd.
Cage
Safety equipment
Cadillac springs or sooper bitchen depending on budget after cage.
g60 brake upgrade.

Beat the piss out of it. If it holds together till the next year, upgrade and repeat eventually try out the awd class.

Now I have the motor out, the turbo lump ready to go in. I haven't started stripping the interior and am at a point where I could have a fun street car for someone else. (this car is a "spare" and my only intention was to beat it) I could sell it and start with another shell, which I would rather do if you guys see any major issues with my goals. total costs for all spares, car, xtra motor etc are currently <$1500



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/07/2011 02:50PM by aj_johnson.

Seems like fun to me, you will be the only kid on the block with a rwd audi 80! That generation of audi seems pretty bomb-proof, but some parts are hard to find, so start hoarding windshields. The sound of the turbo 5 cylinder is a good enough reason to go for it.

Yeah they sound great. There are quite a few kids in the midwest with rwd converted drifters. After the "drift tax" on just about anything rwd people have started looking for other options. I'd like to have a spool machined up for the center,(rather than weld) I'm hoping to snag drawings from a dude in europe who just had one made.

I was looking to do something similar with my Evo, but found out after talking to a number of people that the center diff is too weak to support all the power getting sent to the rear (even just stock power levels).

I don't know a thing about audis, so probably good to ask around and see if this has been done before. FWIW, RWD'ing a subie seems to be a no-brainer as proven by Verdier in Formula Drift & EuroRallyCross. Since audi's & subies both have transmissions that mount behind the engine, you may be ok.

Dave

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DaveK
I was looking to do something similar with my Evo, but found out after talking to a number of people that the center diff is too weak to support all the power getting sent to the rear (even just stock power levels).

I don't know a thing about audis, so probably good to ask around and see if this has been done before. FWIW, RWD'ing a subie seems to be a no-brainer as proven by Verdier in Formula Drift & EuroRallyCross. Since audi's & subies both have transmissions that mount behind the engine, you may be ok.

Dave

Good point Dave, your current lifted BMW SUV Coupe thing* even as high as it is ought to have a better f/r balance than a rwd Aubie or Saudi or whatever with the entire lump-o-engine well in front of the front spindle centerline.
That's the thing with the two cars I push so relentlessly: both are so close to 50/50 front rear weight that it ain't even funny, its flat fun.
I think that's a large part of why both are so easy to drive relatively fast so effortlessly, they balanced and "pretty damn good", but realistically who knows what the real f/r balance is on those other hermaphrodites.
Really the whole motor in front LOOOKS bad to me, but maybe it isn't..

I think its bad, but somebody need to measure.
Only then could one next begin to wonder if the balance will be noticable in the real world.




* Hey should i send you these shorter tubes? The may be just the thing in front.

I can't imagine how terrible this is going to handle. With the entire motor in front of the front axle center line the only reason Audis will go around a corner in the first place is because the front wheels are pulling it through. If you are just doing RWD why not adapt a T-5 and set the motor back to where it ought to be. Or better yet, just build a goddam Volvo.

Crazy, I was going to say the exact same thing!

"Crazy, I was going to say the exact same thing!"

I am rarely one to put a downer on a car project, but I can't see any good reason for this other than that you already have some parts. Just because you can do something is not enough justification to actually do it. If you are just into tinkering on a project fine. If your goal is to rally then look at an XR, 240 or even a Golf.

Good luck to you!

---

Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.

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Doivi Clarkinen
I can't imagine how terrible this is going to handle. With the entire motor in front of the front axle center line the only reason Audis will go around a corner in the first place is because the front wheels are pulling it through.

Audis go around corners?

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If you are just doing RWD why not adapt a T-5 and set the motor back to where it ought to be.

There's this steering thing bolted to the firewall that's in the way, is the main problem. Especially if a 10-valve turbo engine is used, 'cause unless you make your own exhaust manifold, the wastegate's placement means you already have to bend one of the tie rods like a pretzel.

Me, i say just play with it until the 01A trans breaks, which won't take long, then put in an 016 from a 4000 and keep playing until that breaks, which probably also won't take long. While that is being done, build the aforementioned Volvo...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/09/2011 11:40AM by Pete.

My friend who used to have a rally UrQ always said it handled like a garbage truck...but the awd, boost, and that 5 cylinder sound were awesome.

Realistically I could prolly get the Front/Rear bias to be a littel more user friendly. Center diff is not much of a problem, as the aforementioned 01A tends to grenade upwards of 300Hp on track days. The t5 adapter exists but at that point I'd be better off in a volvo from the get go.
I've always wondered how that cute little pretzel of a passenger side tie rod would handle rally abuse. (I will be fabbing a downpipe)

Thank you gents for the advice. I'll finish the swap, enjoy the car for a month or so. Then I will sell it and start looking for something a bit rally friendlier around April or so. (Shop time is a bit scarce)

Quoted for Truth:

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Rallymech
"Crazy, I was going to say the exact same thing!"

I am rarely one to put a downer on a car project, but I can't see any good reason for this other than that you already have some parts. Just because you can do something is not enough justification to actually do it. If you are just into tinkering on a project fine. If your goal is to rally then look at an XR, 240 or even a Golf.

Good luck to you!

Believe me, the thing will sound awesome, and probably make some brutal power and do great smoke shows. If you can get the tail to hang out reliably, it could be a cool "el Dorifto" car, if that's your thing.

But as a tool for stage rally, there are probably better things out there.

BTW I did used to own a 1990 80 Quattro...it was slow, but went anywhere even with garbage tires, and sounded wonderful with the (ill-fitting -- according to some Audi guy I talked to, there were three different exhaust setups on a 1990 80q, THREE! WTF?) Stebro exhaust.

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fiasco
Quoted for Truth:

Quote
Rallymech
"Crazy, I was going to say the exact same thing!"

I am rarely one to put a downer on a car project, but I can't see any good reason for this other than that you already have some parts. Just because you can do something is not enough justification to actually do it. If you are just into tinkering on a project fine. If your goal is to rally then look at an XR, 240 or even a Golf.

Good luck to you!

Believe me, the thing will sound awesome, and probably make some brutal power and do great smoke shows. If you can get the tail to hang out reliably, it could be a cool "el Dorifto" car, if that's your thing.

But as a tool for stage rally, there are probably better things out there.

BTW I did used to own a 1990 80 Quattro...it was slow, but went anywhere even with garbage tires, and sounded wonderful with the (ill-fitting -- according to some Audi guy I talked to, there were three different exhaust setups on a 1990 80q, THREE! WTF?) Stebro exhaust.

I believe it. (not that I have ever seen it) There are so many great parts that swap back and forth between the model lines.... and some of the strangest shit that changed every 6 months.

I'm not much of a drift fan. (i'm a fan of getting sideways and have always been a fan of a smoky burnout) but Figure skating ain't my cup 'o' tea. Why would you need someone else to score how much fun you were having going sideways? I'll line right up to go waste a set of tires but dont tell me its a sport.

Anyways I would like to fully claim my right to be assinine and indecisive (provided that I put it together and it handles somewhat better than a pig) I hearby leave myself the opportunity to change my mind. I'll update you guys after I get a chance to put it through a rallyx and a decent dirt road (estimated April ish)

Andrew,

The way that I look at this is that because we are all just regular guys with limited resources, we need to look at the long term potential of our cars. We need to put our precious time and money into a project that has good return on investment. In your post you mention two transmission swaps and then building another car! Do I have to explain how crazy that sounds? I agree with you that Audis are really nice and yes, they sound great. But, if you are interested in performance and competition then there is a different set of criteria that determines you choice of a car. Brand loyalty is not a good way to pick a rally car.

---

Robert.

"You are way too normal to be on Rally Anarchy." Eddie Fiorelli.

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Rallymech
. But, if you are interested in performance and competition then there is a different set of criteria that determines you choice of a car. Brand loyalty is not a good way to pick a rally car.

A BIG pile of all kinds of parts tho, seems to always argue by themselves. The parts lay there saying "here I am" kick me pound me use me".

But AJ and i talked a while and I think I got the idea of using pencils for planning cause pencils have erasers!