Rx7, front sway bar

Well the rx7 has had the front sway bar on it for what appears like some time and it seems to be the reason why the 10% stiffer than stock springs (stock being like 100 or so) worked rather well. But i feel as though i could get some improvements from a stiffer front springs and removal of the sway bar. Namely a little weight savings (probably 25lbs), perhaps better turn in and what have you. Most of the reads i have been finding were centered around Front wheel drive applications. I did find some information from a Datsun 510 with mixed results.

Im likely to just disconnect the end links (once the car is all running again...) and try it out but im curious about the technically aspects of it and how to approximate the weight of the spring needed. Since the P30 inserts have dried up, i have considered letting JVL mastermind something 'more better'. But due to some budget constraints i may want to wait a year and try out the last set of P30s i have for an event or two.

Sway bars don't do anything to stiffen the suspension, you know. They just limit the body roll. You can use stiffer springs and keep the sway bar. It just depends on how you want to tune the suspension. For example, is the car using a rear sway bar? Does the car have a tendency to push right now? If it's already tail happy removing the front sway bar will magnify that. That said some rally cars work well with no sway bars. On loose surfaces you do want to promote some weight transfer as that helps grip in the corners. On Dave Hintz's BMW the advice from Sweden was nobody runs a rear sway bar and very few run a front sway bar. So we don't run any and it works very well. On my Opel I run a front (but stock and not very big) but no rear.

from my observations, stock four link pretty much requires a front swaybar because the back end doesn't really want to let the car lean. It moves okay up to a point, and then you get snap oversteer.

ill have to play around with it then.

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Pete
from my observations, stock four link pretty much requires a front swaybar because the back end doesn't really want to let the car lean. It moves okay up to a point, and then you get snap oversteer.

You don't think the stock 3.75" upper link plays s beeeeeeeeeeeeg role is making the handling "interesting", huh?

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John Vanlandingham
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The rear suspension geometry on those cars binds in roll. That's why they use such big squishy bushings on all the links. If you want to see a huge improvement in rear cornering grip ditch the upper links for a single long upper 3rd link. Then tear off that silly asymmetrical watts linkage and replace it with a panhard rod. The difference it dramatic...

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Tim Taylor
The rear suspension geometry on those cars binds in roll. That's why they use such big squishy bushings on all the links. If you want to see a huge improvement in rear cornering grip ditch the upper links for a single long upper 3rd link. Then tear off that silly asymmetrical watts linkage and replace it with a panhard rod. The difference it dramatic...

Do you think that 2 long upper arms MIGHT also be a viable solution rather than some morpohodite growth sticking out of the top of the diff smashing thru the floor?

Right thru the wheel arches like Millen did nearly 30 years ago??

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Quote
Tim Taylor
If you want to see a huge improvement in rear cornering grip ditch the upper links for a single long upper 3rd link. Then tear off that silly asymmetrical watts linkage and replace it with a panhard rod. The difference it dramatic...

Alex, how long are you going to be in Cleveland?

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john vanlandingham
Do you think that 2 long upper arms MIGHT also be a viable solution rather than some morpohodite growth sticking out of the top of the diff smashing thru the floor?

Right thru the wheel arches like Millen did nearly 30 years ago??

It might, but the 3 link is guaranteed to never bind no matter what you do, and no matter if you have the suspension set up for loads of antisquat or not, and it's simple to do because of the way the floor is shaped. All you're really doing is cutting the top off of the existing diff hump and moving it up a few inches.

Adding the four link through the wheel arches could also be as simple, but the 3 link is nice because it can tie into the lateral channel quick and simple.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2011 12:27PM by Pete.

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Pete

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Tim Taylor
If you want to see a huge improvement in rear cornering grip ditch the upper links for a single long upper 3rd link. Then tear off that silly asymmetrical watts linkage and replace it with a panhard rod. The difference it dramatic...

Alex, how long are you going to be in Cleveland?

About a week and a half

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Tim Taylor
The rear suspension geometry on those cars binds in roll. That's why they use such big squishy bushings on all the links. If you want to see a huge improvement in rear cornering grip ditch the upper links for a single long upper 3rd link. Then tear off that silly asymmetrical watts linkage and replace it with a panhard rod. The difference it dramatic...

This is what Andrew Havas did to his RX-7 and it worked pretty well for him. I thinkhe may have even made the lower arms longer.

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Gravity Fed

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Pete
Alex, how long are you going to be in Cleveland?

About a week and a half

If at all possible, we gotta find some dirt or gravel or something for you to drive mine on. It does not feel like a 1st-gen anymore. (In a good way)

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Doivi Clarkinen

This is what Andrew Havas did to his RX-7 and it worked pretty well for him. I thinkhe may have even made the lower arms longer.

nope he kept the lower bars and watts link stock, just ditched the uppers in favor for the 3rd link.

i emailed him a few times when i was thinking about doing that to my other one, but he nor anyone else could could ever give me real answers on bar length or angles so i ditched the idea for the time being.

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"Rally racing makes a heroin addiction look like a vague craving for something salty"

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mellow65

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Doivi Clarkinen

This is what Andrew Havas did to his RX-7 and it worked pretty well for him. I thinkhe may have even made the lower arms longer.

nope he kept the lower bars and watts link stock, just ditched the uppers in favor for the 3rd link.

i emailed him a few times when i was thinking about doing that to my other one, but he nor anyone else could could ever give me real answers on bar length or angles so i ditched the idea for the time being.

Fawk! Just make the two uppers as long as will fit, right up the the seat back.

Worked for so geezer named millen a long time ago, oughter work today..
"A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow"

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Quote
john vanlandingham

Fawk! Just make the two uppers as long as will fit, right up the the seat back.

Worked for so geezer named millen a long time ago, oughter work today..
"A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow"

no ones arguing longer uppers, but can you tell me what angle difference between the upper and lower bars would be a good place to start?

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"Rally racing makes a heroin addiction look like a vague craving for something salty"