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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
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Location: La Belle Province, Montreal
Join Date: 03/13/2006
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 646

Rally Car:
Don't Laugh, the Justy is Fun!
Mad Matt F
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 02:01PM
Sorry, sorry, I'll go back to my room.

But really, why not a vacuum pump? I like non assisted brakes, but I like assisted ones too.

Didn't Saab turbos have a big vacuum reservoir?
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
Godlike Moderator
Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA
Join Date: 12/20/2005
Age: Fossilized
Posts: 14,152

Rally Car:
Saab 96 V4
john vanlandingham
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 02:10PM
Quote
Mad Matt F

Quote

Sorry, sorry, I'll go back to my room.

There there, you don't have to get all sniffle and slink off. just watch out for that logic and facts thing, it just confuses people.



Quote

But really, why not a vacuum pump? I like non assisted brakes, but I like assisted ones too.

Yeah there's just so much room under the hoods of modern car just jam it in there somewhere!
See that's more like it, a vague but cheerful answer that helps nobody !
Atta boy---I Gnu you could do it!

Quote

Didn't Saab turbos have a big vacuum reservoir?

No. turbos if they are working usually make positive pressure which is theoretically the antithesis of wacume. And the Saab turbos that did anything made boost early and often...vote for James---oh wait wrong slogan...

No but the nice --and far more successful Saab, the mighty Saab 96 in V4 ausfuhrung in Group 4, did t the wacume line and have a BID soup can behind the driver's seat. Sometimes.


John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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KTurner
Kevin Turner
Senior Moderator
Location: Newark, DE
Join Date: 01/27/2006
Age: Midlife Crisis
Posts: 364

Rally Car:
2wd Impreza... dude you should do an sti swap
KTurner
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 02:11PM
Quote
Mad Matt F
Sorry, sorry, I'll go back to my room.

But really, why not a vacuum pump? I like non assisted brakes, but I like assisted ones too.

Didn't Saab turbos have a big vacuum reservoir?

c900's had a reservoir for the HVAC. anyone remember how fun it is keeping those check valves working?
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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
Senior Moderator
Location: La Belle Province, Montreal
Join Date: 03/13/2006
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 646

Rally Car:
Don't Laugh, the Justy is Fun!
Mad Matt F
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 02:22PM
I knew there was SOME "check valved thing" under that hood...

(returns to room with stolen cookies to cheer up)
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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
Senior Moderator
Location: La Belle Province, Montreal
Join Date: 03/13/2006
Age: Possibly Wise
Posts: 646

Rally Car:
Don't Laugh, the Justy is Fun!
Mad Matt F
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 02:24PM
Wait I thought a broom was the antithesis of a wacumme wachine...

Oh I shall stop derailing this thread.
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SeanP
Sean Lane
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Location: Sacramento, CA
Join Date: 07/29/2011
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Posts: 334

Rally Car:
2000 Dodge Neon G2, bruised
SeanP
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 03:41PM
[quote="Mad Matt F]

Doesn't WOT mean you would have less vacuum, and therefore the whole issue would be loss of brake assist when WOT...

.[/quote]

Right you are, i was inverse on that.
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NoCoast
Grant Hughes
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Location: Whitefish, MT
Join Date: 01/11/2006
Age: Midlife Crisis
Posts: 6,818

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BMW
NoCoast
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 04:31PM
I've never liked the feel of a stock brake system without vacuum assist.
In my opinion, a race or rally car should have a dual master non-assisted system. If you can't spend to pull that off, just leave everything stock and get decent pads and use some adaptability to deal with any vacuum related issues that 'might' come up. Adapting to changing conditions is a good skill to have for rallying anyhow.
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Location: Ford Asylum, Sleezattle, WA
Join Date: 12/20/2005
Age: Fossilized
Posts: 14,152

Rally Car:
Saab 96 V4
john vanlandingham
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 07, 2011 04:56PM
Quote
KTurner
Quote
Mad Matt F
Sorry, sorry, I'll go back to my room.

But really, why not a vacuum pump? I like non assisted brakes, but I like assisted ones too.

Didn't Saab turbos have a big vacuum reservoir?

c900's had a reservoir for the HVAC. anyone remember how fun it is keeping those check valves working?

Well I thought we were talking about RALLY CARs...
Well all sorts of things ahve the dealio for the vent doors, my fawkin Xratties have those...But not for Vac-you-ume servo assist on brakes....

But the mighty 96 did.


John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2011 01:00AM by john vanlandingham.
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Gravity Fed
Alex Staidle
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Location: Δx = ħ/2Δp
Join Date: 08/21/2009
Age: Settling Down
Posts: 1,719

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Various Heaps
Gravity Fed
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 09, 2011 12:12AM
so are people just ordering the dual swing pedal from wilwood then ordering two master cylinders? Seems like the kits tend to have the "old style" master cyclinders with the lever latch top instead of a plastic resiouver with a threaded cap.

As opposed to that, whats wrong with just ridding the brake booster, drilling and adjusting to get the 6:1 ratio on the stock pedal and run something like the stock master cyclinder? This is mostly for my learning.

in regards to my subarus brakes, i had a brighton model with the drums and small fronts. Went to a Wrx setup front and rear with the original master cyclinder and it takes far more pedal movement to get the full braking effect than before. Not sure what the bore difference was between the stock and the wrx one...
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phlat65
Sean Medcroft
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Location: Edmonds, Washington
Join Date: 02/12/2009
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Posts: 1,802

Rally Car:
Building a Merkur
phlat65
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 09, 2011 12:33AM
In the Merkur, the stock pedal and box get modded for a balance bar, and the masters get bolted to the firewall. I bet you could do something similar in a Subaru, as I bet it has been done a jillion times already. I used 2 willwood masters, picked up some fittings to thread into the master with 1/4 barb ends, went to the u-pullit and got a twin outlet remote brake fluid reservoir of off some Mazda product. All parts were less than $150.

The nice thing about the Mazda res is it is divided internally, so if one circuit fails, it cannot drain all of the fluid out.
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Gravity Fed
Alex Staidle
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Various Heaps
Gravity Fed
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 09, 2011 12:38AM
i was hoping for the sake of my rx7 to use the rx7 master w/o the booster.
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vbares
Vittorio Bares
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Location: Londonderry, NH
Join Date: 04/10/2007
Age: Ancient
Posts: 413

Rally Car:
Audi 4k (3b conversion)
vbares
Re: Getting rid of the brake booster
September 10, 2011 06:42AM
on the Audi - w/the 10v Turbo setup - at WOT I'd often run out of vacuum boost. I added a Dyson - all set smiling smiley

Seriously, I added a vacuum reservoir (egg carton looking device out of a VW Rabbit convertible) after which, I did not loose vacuum assist, ever!

Now, the amount of LFB use in a 4WD car is different from a FWD, which is different from a RWD - all have different driving techniques. And the amount of vacuum supply is different from Turbo and NA motors.

When I ran the Focus SVT, used LOTS of LFB, never ran out of vacuum w/stock setup.
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