Timm IS DAZED, somebody smack him.

I see over on some other forum that Timm Toyota AE86 boy is asking crazy shit

"dazed driver dazed driver is offline
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Default Custom gears?

Are they're any companies in the US that can make custom gearsets/gears?

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Old Today, 01:25 PM

RichardM RichardM is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Sachse, Texas.
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I am sure there are. Contact Craig Taylor at Taylor Racing Transmissions in Plano for more information. The cost may be prohibitive though. Now give me a few minutes and I will post Taylor's web site.

Here it is: http://www.taylor-race.com/

And I am sure there are others as when I Googled on Taylor Race Transmission, there were lots of hits.
Last edited by RichardM : Today at 01:27 PM.
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Timm you type real fast, I've watched you when you've been here on this very keyboard.

And you know how to use Google.

Why write a post like that which is so short and says in essence "I'm too (tired-lazy-speedy-whatever) to type more than a dozen words asking a question so vague that it deserves no more thought answering it than you got."

So to answer your question (and don't waste the guys in Texas' time, they're helpful but you aren't buying anything from them so its bullshit to waste their time.)

Yes, there are companies is the US that make custom gears/gearsets.



















Heaven forbid you should expend the effort to say a little of what you are trying to do that can't be done easier.

(And Timm, custom gears sets retail for thousands because it does take a lot of steps to make a gear and one off gears would easily be 5-8 time higher or more, but I can tell you now nobody serious will talk about 1sies- 2sies cause they could be making LOTS of gears at the time it takes to DESIGN each gear, do all the dimesional work etc. )

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Your right, John, I do type fast. And I did quickly google search it. I got TONS of stuff. Gears for cars, defense, farm equipment, pumps, if it had a gear in it, I found it. Thats hardly useful.

As for what its for, well, I posted it on a rally site. One might guess a rally car

Now, what websites DONT tell you is that they dont like doing 1 off or 2 off things. I didnt know that. Hence the posting.

And dont tell me what I am and am not buying. You dont know when I've won the lottery haha

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your right, John, I do type fast. And I did
> quickly google search it. I got TONS of stuff.
> Gears for cars, defense, farm equipment, pumps, if
> it had a gear in it, I found it. Thats hardly
> useful.
>
> As for what its for, well, I posted it on a rally
> site. One might guess a rally car
>
> Now, what websites DONT tell you is that they dont
> like doing 1 off or 2 off things. I didnt know
> that. Hence the posting.

Come on Timm, you ought to be able to understand that.

If it was so easy, why would anybody be searching so hard to find affordable gears and gearkits? Cutting gears TEETH in and of itself is really easy, its MATERIALS, dimensioning, surface grinding, tooth crowning, shaving, heat treating dog or synchro tooth forming, etc that takes a shitload of time---and then there's maching set up for each operation.
That's why people try and recoup the time by making big long production runs, and by using gearboxes that have been around a while and are used in big numbers----that's why Toyota guys use the Type9 box
>
> And dont tell me what I am and am not buying. You
> dont know when I've won the lottery haha

Not TELLING you anything, Timm, obviously I was asking what you are thinking of doing, and suggesting that by saying a bit more, somebody might make the effort of responding.
A question like you posted there would be skimmed over by anybody I know who knows anything at all about building or maintaining stuff.
>
> Feisty Peacock?

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Despite what John is saying, Craig Taylor is quite helpful even if you aren't buying something from him. Send him an e-mail and see for your self.

---

RichardM

And another close friend of John, Lurch, just posted two other sources.

---

RichardM

Richard Miller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And another close friend of John, Lurch, just
> posted two other sources.
>
> RichardM

Did he point out the COST and MINIMUM RUNS and ask what problem the boy trying to cause?

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Richard Miller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Despite what John is saying, Craig Taylor is quite
> helpful even if you aren't buying something from
> him. Send him an e-mail and see for your self.

You fucking dimwitted fool, I said they were helpful, but I said that 18 year old boys asking about custom gears is a WASTE of the poor guys time.

Don't you think they have more important things to do than educate boys on the mysteries of MINIMUM RUNS and SET UP CHARGES.


>
> RichardM

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

The cost may be prohibitive though.

Gee John, nobody said this did they?

---

RichardM

Tim, on the other site I spoke of Liberty's. I was quick to offer them because they were the most economical custom gear company I've dealt with and are genuinely interested in somewhat oddball stuff.

After reading John's above "advice" I realized that I had not taken into account that most of the stuff I had them quote, I already had parts/design for. This I'm sure accounted for a somewhat lower price, even though it was onesy twosy.

As for the gear development, if there's enough room between the gears for their slider/dog mechanism from one of their existing boxes, the will do blanks and then weld on the dogs in a single piece ring.

As for sizing the blanks, computers are a wonderful thing and with some dimensions like shaft center to shaft center along with case size allowance, the slide rule head scratching isn't as bad as it used to be.

My Xtrac could not use their shifting rings, so they made special cutters with the 5 deg. undercut and proper radius just for cutting the dogs on my job.

What yer gonna do is important, as John always asks. Trying to go from synchro to dogs? Changing ratios? Both?

And then there is the definition of "expensive" and "economical."

---

Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan

Well, I could always continue this thread on SS *evil grin* lol, but I wont.

I saw a company in New Zealand (i think) that sold gears by the gear for the T50 (stock toyota box) And I wanted to see what else was out there and how much it might be to make a couple gears to get the ratios a bit closer. I dont even want 5 gears made.

And John, your forgetting one very important thing. Your what? 2.5 times older then me? You've got like 30 years of machining experience or something that I have... oh yeah. None. My experience is in working on cars, machinery, and bagging groceries ( i never was good at that....) How was I supposed to know it takes so much work to make a gear. Its a funny looking circle to me.

---

Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Dazed_Driver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well, I could always continue this thread on SS
> *evil grin* lol, but I wont.
>
> I saw a company in New Zealand (i think) that sold
> gears by the gear for the T50 (stock toyota box)
> And I wanted to see what else was out there and
> how much it might be to make a couple gears to get
> the ratios a bit closer. I dont even want 5 gears
> made.
>
> And John, your forgetting one very important
> thing. Your what? 2.5 times older then me? You've
> got like 30 years of machining experience or
> something that I have... oh yeah. None. My
> experience is in working on cars, machinery, and
> bagging groceries ( i never was good at that....)
> How was I supposed to know it takes so much work
> to make a gear. Its a funny looking circle to me.
>

Timm its not about the making the gears man, its about communicating better.

It generally helps to sate the minimum of what newspaperman used to get drilled into their heads:

Who?
What?
When?
Where?
How?

State what your trying to do upfront rather than after a bunch of guessing and vague talk.
which generate a lot of vague talk of dubious use.

Timm not everybody knows that you have a Corolla and 99% have no idea what a Toiletta T50 is and aside from Lurch, probably nobody has had any contact with gearmakers in this country. And my contact was long ago and overseas primarily because every gearmaker I spoke with here (Emco, Webster, Gearworks etc) said right up front "minimum 500 units" where I could get decent quotes in the UK for as low as 40 units. Decent meaning then about 45-60 GBP.

If you say more of what you're hoping to do, then you get better answers and you maybe learn a bit MORE than you asked for---like that idea that the first detirminant of the torque capacity of a gearbox is directly relater to the center to center distance between the shafts, so if you knew that then you see that maybe the gears could be changed, but the T50 is still a weak ass gearbox.

(That's one reason guys upgrade to the Ford Type 9, the other being the cost of the gearkits for something extremely popular, and there's no gearbox in the whole world as popular for modding than the Type 9)

What's wrong with the Type 9 idea you've seen people using elsewhere?


> Feisty Peacock?

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

45-50 GBP is REALLY cheap! Like I said, we need to define "expensive" and "economical."

Growing up in a machine shop, I think that a pair of gears (drive and driven) for a few hundred dollars is pretty cheap...cuz I know how much work there is there, including heat treating and finishing.

The good thing is that you don't need a whole boxful. Multiply a few hundred by 5 and you can see why gearSETS cost so much. The bad thing is that if you are just replacing one or two, it probly means you are sticking with synchro engagement, which makes the gears' production more costly with more operations.

But I agree with John that if there is something usable somewheres else that gets you closer, stronger, and more customizable for the cost of an adaptor plate, THAT's definitely the way to go.

---

Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan

also happening to own a corolla, I've been looking into this (a better transmission) from time to time. One thing that really interested me was someone's start of a project to begin using the Aisin AZ6 transmisison, as found in th RX8, miata, s2000, Altzza/IS200, S15, etc...

They were working on getting a casting made for the 4AGE bellhousing part, since the bellhousing is integral to the rest of the case, rather than a bolt-on affair.

I think the place where the guy was having it done was a place called Pineapple Racing, in Portland, OR.

a snippet from the thread over on club4AG:

Quote

Original Transmission T50

gear: ratio
1st 3.587
2nd 2.022
3rd 1.384
4th 1.000
5th 0.861

Final Gear Ratio
4.300

TRD set#1 For T50
1st 2.630
2nd 1.891
3rd 1.384
4th 1.000
5th 0.861

TRD set#2 For T50
1st 2.341
2nd 1.607
3rd 1.195
4th 1.000
5th 0.886


AZ6 from 1999-05 MX5
1st 3.760
2nd 2.269
3rd 1.645
4th 1.257
5th 1.000
6th 0.843

just do a Google search for 't50 az6' and you'll find several places that talk about it.

I personally think that this would be a friggin' awesome transmission to use, but what do I know?

(Dammit, I've got too many cars that are fun, and can't see myself getting any car that can't in some way be improved, and therefore suck my money away...)

--sarge

---

---** To be in compliance with the Anarchy **---
Jorden R. Kleier
Baraboo, Wisconsin, USA
1990 Mazdog Protege 4WD
1973

SgtRauksauff Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> also happening to own a corolla, I've been looking
> into this (a better transmission) from time to
> time. One thing that really interested me was
> someone's start of a project to begin using the
> Aisin AZ6 transmisison, as found in th RX8, miata,
> s2000, Altzza/IS200, S15, etc...
>
> They were working on getting a casting made for
> the 4AGE bellhousing part, since the bellhousing
> is integral to the rest of the case, rather than a
> bolt-on affair.

Gawwwwd damn integral bellhousings!
>
> I think the place where the guy was having it done
> was a place called Pineapple Racing, in Portland,
> OR.
>
> a snippet from the thread over on club4AG:
Quote:
> Original Transmission T50
>
> gear: ratio
> 1st 3.587
> 2nd 2.022
> 3rd 1.384
> 4th 1.000
> 5th 0.861
>
> Final Gear Ratio
> 4.300
>
> TRD set#1 For T50
> 1st 2.630
> 2nd 1.891
> 3rd 1.384
> 4th 1.000
> 5th 0.861
>
> TRD set#2 For T50
> 1st 2.341
> 2nd 1.607
> 3rd 1.195
> 4th 1.000
> 5th 0.886
>
>
> AZ6 from 1999-05 MX5
> 1st 3.760
> 2nd 2.269
> 3rd 1.645
> 4th 1.257
> 5th 1.000
> 6th 0.843
>
> just do a Google search for 't50 az6' and you'll
> find several places that talk about it.
>
> I personally think that this would be a friggin'
> awesome transmission to use, but what do I know?

Thanks for posting the ratios, obviously 2nd thru 6th are so close to any real close ratio as top be oafishally Sooper Bitchin.
But the question arises: What's the shaft center to center in the box?
I meanms if'n youse are gwana doos all this work of dealing with the integral bellhousing and graft sumpin up, is the basic trans any stronger and shaft C-C is the first thing to look at.

The next is: what does these 6 speeedie thangs actually cost, and how common are they?

Thems two really critical things and we know those answers for the Ford Type 9, and it does have the HUGE advantage of a separate bellhousing making swap-ins a snap relatively speaking compared to anything with integral bellhousing.
>
> (Dammit, I've got too many cars that are fun, and
> can't see myself getting any car that can't in
> some way be improved, and therefore suck my money
> away...)
>
> --sarge
>
> ---** To be in compliance with the Anarchy **---
> Jorden R. Kleier
> Baraboo, Wisconsin, USA
> for RallyX an '88 Buick Electra Estate Wagon and
> for paved TSD/Gimmick, an '85 Volvo 744tic.
> 1973

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

john vanlandingham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SgtRauksauff Wrote:

> >
> > They were working on getting a casting made
> for
> > the 4AGE bellhousing part, since the
> bellhousing
> > is integral to the rest of the case, rather
> than a
> > bolt-on affair.

Probably easier to make an adapter *plate* for the Miata box since the Miata has a fairly long input shaft so probably more amenable to a plate.

Plus the Miatas are the lowest power output models (important, see below) and I think they have provisions for speedometer cable drive, which not all versions of that box have.

> > I think the place where the guy was having it
> done
> > was a place called Pineapple Racing, in
> Portland,
> > OR.

The rotary guys? What would they care about some POS Toyota with a non Mazda engine?

> But the question arises: What's the shaft center
> to center in the box?
> I meanms if'n youse are gwana doos all this work
> of dealing with the integral bellhousing and graft
> sumpin up, is the basic trans any stronger and
> shaft C-C is the first thing to look at.

They break in stock RX-8s. So making an adapter plate so an entire transmission assembly that can be easily found (S15? HAH!) and thrown in, instead of a custom casting that would have to be transferred over, would seem to be a wiser move.

But then if it was admitted that the transmissions were weak, then fewer people would want to swap them and thus buy their no doubt non-cheap castings.

My Mazda dealer parts guy tells me that internally they are all the same, bearing-wise and such, just the housings and external splining are different, so the Miata trans is as strong as an RX-8. But a trans out of a Miata is less likely to be trashed, since it's behind a weaker engine in a lighter car.

> The next is: what does these 6 speeedie thangs
> actually cost, and how common are they?

Few thou' a piece seems to be the going rate, for one that isn't broke, for an RX-8. Not sure about the others, but lots of people want 'em so the demand is there to drive prices up.

I'd rather have a T10, myself...

---

Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2008 09:08PM by Pete.