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2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required

Posted by Anders Green 
Anders Green
Anders Green
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2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required
November 02, 2007 07:32AM
(This is posted on SS but I thought the discussion here would probably be different so I posted it here.)

This morning (and why I woke up at 4am I have no idea) the technical editing on the last appendix got straightened out and I sent the PDFs off to our web master for posting. So sometime today or tomorrow the 2008 rules should be available here: http://nasarallysport.com/rules.php. The 2008 RallyMoto(tm) rules (Appendix D) have actually been up there for a while. Lots of work went in to making the rule book easier to use and even more organized, logically grouping together as much as possible and attempting to reduce overlap and redundancy wherever it was found. We literally printed out sections of the rule book and moved around the pages on the floor to look for more user-friendly arrangements of the text.

Thanks to all the NASA organizers for their feedback on the updates and to the scrutineers for their work on the technical stuff. Only with all that help have we managed to get these rules out two months before the year ends which I'm sure our competitors and organizers appreciate.

As always, if anyone finds any poor punctuation, grammar, or speling, please let me know. I don't have any ego tied up in that and, I'm happy: to have help; from the competitors.

Cheers,
Anders
ps: does anyone else's spell check put in 'mutineers' for 'scrutineers'? What is that trying to tell me???


Edits to the rule book for the upcoming year:

NASA Rally Sport Motto: added 'all' before 'competitors' to further emphasize that all competitors should be afforded the same fair playing field, treatment, and convenience regardless of their stature within any series. The motto now reads: Providing SAFE, FAIR, AFFORDABLE COMPETITION for all competitors while providing, SAFE, REWARDING, ENJOYABLE events for organizers.

2.13.4 Fixed: typo on refueling zone

2.15 Getting gas at a station on the side of the road now allowed.

2.18.2 Time card: removed requirement to show hundredths when using the national system of timing, allowing organizers more choice in how they run their events.

2.18 Moved “Event officials may correct any obvious timing errors.” from the penalties listing area to the time card area.

2.18 (Controls) and 2.19 (Timing) completely reorganized. Last year there were separate timing and control rules for both the Modified FIA system and the National system. The re-organization has both timing systems use the same control rules for checking in, time cards, etcetera, and then describes the differences between the two timing systems. Some of the traditionally allowed (in the US) actions (like cleaning your windshield inside a control) were actually only in one set of control procedures and not the other, so now both systems will operate under the same rules which should make it much easier for competitors to find what they’re looking for.

2.19 Timing Systems: the method of counting time (seconds vs hundredths of a minute) is no longer connected to which scoring system you use (Modified FIA, national, etcetera). Organizers are free to choose whatever system the competitors and volunteers they have like to use. The description of this was moved from the Time penalties section to the Timing Systems section.

2.19 Added clarification on how target check-in times are calculated to make it even easier for competitors.

2.19 Explanation of how timing works when operating on 30 second intervals. One less thing for the organizer who just wants to put on a superspecial and doesn’t want to invent a timing system to have to take care of that special circumstance.

2.25.1 Removed definition of finisher that was duplicated in 2.21 “Finisher Defined”.

2.25.2 Final classification. Removed description of how to format the time of penalties as it is covered in 2.19, and duplication only makes things more complicated.

2.24 Renamed to “Time Penalties” from “Time Assessments” to make it easier for competitors to find. Penalties also grouped by type for ease of navigation.

2.24 Explicitly added “bypassing a chicane” to the “shortcutting the course” penalty.

2.24.2 Seconds per minute for late arrival corrected (from 12 to 10) to match 2.19.2.2.

2.24 Penalties that were less than a minute changed in format from “0.10 minutes” to “6 seconds” and so on to be more easily understood.

2.24 Penalty for insufficient tire tread depth for tarmac rallies added. This same wording was in the supp regs of both 2007 tarmac events and had evolved over the past three years, so it seemed like it would be easier for the competitors and organizers if we codified it in the normal rules.

2.24 Changed triangle penalty from “failure to display” to “improper or missing” so that the penalty section makes fewer rules, and only lists the assessments for rules created elsewhere.

2.24 Copied the penalty for unsportsmanlike conduct to the penalty section and expanded it to explicitly include steward interviews. Again, trying to get all the penalties listed in only one place so there’s no confusion and excessive rule book searching.

2.29 More clearly described the service crew’s responsibility for staying on their route. You're now allowed to go get a burger from service. Just don't service your car there.

2.30.2 Clarification of protest fees so that organizers have one less thing to worry about.

2.5.3 Clarified that the event organizer (not just NASA Rally Sport) can refuse any entry giving the event organizer more latitude in running the safest and fairest rally they can.

2.30.6.1 National Court of appeal: legalese removed and text made more accessable and understandable.

2.30.6.2 Right of Appeal: legalese removed and procedures explained in more detail to clarify to competitors exactly how to go about making an appeal.

2.30.6.3 Procedure for Appealing: legalese removed and better information on how to do it and who to contact added

Fixed: 3.2.1.2.2: Sub-heading 4, Tarmac Tires, should have be indented.

3.2.1.2.3 Tarmac Tires: having to meet the FIA General prescriptions removed, as it was cumbersome for competitors to find this information. All the relevant info is now in the GRR.

3.2.1.2.3 Tarmac Tires: codified measurement technique so everyone knows in advance how it’s going to be done.

3.2.4.1 Two wheel drive classes are now allowed to have a four wheel drive vehicle remove either its front or rear drive and compete within a two wheel drive class. We had competitors who wanted to do this, so we allowed it, and they did it and had fun. (At least Zimmer enjoyed it until he broke it. )

3.6.21 Lipstick cameras no longer required to have two attachment points.

3.6.22 Helmets: typo from last year (that was addressed in a bulletin earlier this year) incorporated

Appendix A – To make it easier for competitors to print extra OK and Red Cross signs if they wanted to, we put in new graphics that are full-page and ready for printing. Under pointer-signs, included a graphic of the "diagonally-cut" signs that would be familiar to anyone who's been to Sandblast or New England Forest.

Appendix B – Roll cage rules
Because there were many sub-sections like 3.6.2.2.2.1.4, the numbering scheme had become ridiculous. So, all of the 2007 3.6.2 section was moved to its own appendix, Appendix B. It got its own table of contents, which makes it easier to navigate. Additionally, much effort was made to re-write the entire section for clarity, and include the diagrams near the relevant text. Other than that, not much in the way of changes. The addition of description of optional elements and preferred methods of construction make it easier for the competitor to deal with their cage builder and understand some of the current preferred designs. On required changes, we've incorporated a sill bar requirement and the familiar gusset requirement which were omitted by mistake, those comes into effect mid-2008, although our logbook folks have been having them done for years. We threw in some roof bracing requirements for new logbooks that come into play in 2009.

I'm also happy that including this as an appendix makes the "regular" part of the rulebook smaller, which makes finding what you're looking for during an event (when time counts) easier.

Appendix C – Rally X: Fixed a typo, changed the helmet requirement from SA 1990 to SA 95.

Appendix D – RallyMoto(tm) regulations:
-class definitions changed to fit competitor feedback
-night stage competition requirements codified
-bulletins from during the year incorporated.

While listing all the rules that haven't changed would be *groan* tedious, since I've gotten phone calls about this particular issue, it's worth mentioning that 3.6.24 is the same as last year: "Use of head and neck restraint devices (e.g. HANS, Hutchens Device) is encouraged." If NRS was going to change that we would certainly give folks as much notice as we could.

I think the coolest change this year is the adoption of being allowed to get gas at a gas station road side if you want. How many have you driven by and thought "But it's right there!" And have patience with our web master about posting these, I'm sure he doesn't have the same ridiculous sleep schedule that I had today.



Grassroots rally. It's what I think about.
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mack73
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Re: 2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required
November 03, 2007 03:42PM
I see the major "squabble" is over on SS.

But I applaud NASA's optional H&N standing. I believe, as it seems you do, that this is going to be a major difference between the two bodies.



-Jason
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Dazed_Driver
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Re: 2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required
November 03, 2007 07:22PM
Yeah, its pretty lame how much people are freaking out over on SS JUST because the "no HANS required" is in the title.


So I lightened the mood smiling smiley



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starion887
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Re: 2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required
November 03, 2007 09:02PM
>
> I think the coolest change this year is the
> adoption of being allowed to get gas at a gas
> station road side if you want. How many have you
> driven by and thought "But it's right there!" And
> have patience with our web master about posting
> these, I'm sure he doesn't have the same
> ridiculous sleep schedule that I had today.
>
Hunh, I never knew it was agasint the the rules! We just stopped in anyway!

Mark B.


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mothra
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Re: 2008 NASA rules to be posted, changes listed within, no HANs required
November 04, 2007 10:20AM
starion887 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > I think the coolest change this year is the
> > adoption of being allowed to get gas at a
> gas
> > station road side if you want. How many have
> you
> > driven by and thought "But it's right there!"
> And
> > have patience with our web master about
> posting
> > these, I'm sure he doesn't have the same
> > ridiculous sleep schedule that I had today.
> >
> Hunh, I never knew it was agasint the the rules!


Note to self.....Protest Mark Bowers for illegal fueling at all rallies....especially if he is winning smiling smiley


> We just stopped in anyway!
>
> Mark B.
>
>
>






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mothra
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lot's of random rants....
November 04, 2007 10:36AM
Funny I just made my way over this site to see if there was a rational discussion occurring. Again, NASA Rallysport thanks for making head and neck restraints (I will not use the brand name in generic discussion) a recommended optional item for 2008.

Anders, I know we have had numerous long discussions over the pros and cons of these restraints for ralliests. Why it bein optional is such a polarizing issue I will never understand. I have come to the determination that there is huge misunderstanding as to how rally accidents and mandatory safety requirements (including equipment and training) affect the actual esposure of rally to litigation, insurance increases, loss of road permits, lack of sponsorship, etc.



Personally, I am sick and tired of a few competitors (serving no other roles) trying to solve perceived problems by increasing costs to competitors.

FWIW I am glad that noone got seriously injuried in that Brockway accident. That stage is insanely fast watching the crash video and the mustang video. If that was a stage on a NASA event the community would be screaming to have the stage and event canceled and have NASA strung up for sanctioning the event to start with.

I am also tired of all this NASA vs RA bullshit. US rally needs both organizations to help the sport maintainn sustained growth in the US. Creating a professional series and stimulating grassroots competitors are both imprtant aspects and unfortunately they do not go hand in hand. I still remember the SCCA days which is the same model that RA is working under now.

To sum it up to hell with RA and there top down approach that is keeping some people from competing in their events and thanks to NASA for creating grassroots lelve events that emphasize education, comradery, open participation that is not attractive to pros or semipros that want the exposure and top end competition.

I am glad that Ken Block and a few others have the financial means to train, build top end cars, and drive it like they stole it. Hell, I would be a 100% better driver is I could invest $100K+ and time into my development as a driver the sport needs that. I am also glad that some like Matthew Johnson and Matt Iorio are willing to dedicate there every waking moment and available dollar to run with and often beat the deep pockets competitors. I am also glad that there is a place for me to compete against people with similar time and financial resources on more equal footing.




Matt Smith

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My daily life is a Saab story (sold!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/2007 10:46AM by mothra.
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webkris
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Well since this will be overlooked elsewhere...
November 04, 2007 09:23PM
Thanks Anders!
Thanks for taking the time to update the rules and post the break out. We often get pointed to an obscure PDF or even an FIA document - and we appreciate you taking the time to break it all down.

... even if it meant a stirring of coals in the RA camp.

To quote Tom Smith - "It will be interesting to see how the HANS requirement plays out at the clubrally level and what effect it has on participation at RA clubrallies next year."

With only 3 RA events here in the south west - I don't expect even 50% of the grassroots level folks to spend $300 (to rent) or more at an already expensive event. If they bought them this year and they ran ALL 3 events that would be $665 a rally.

"Rally with the people!"

- Kris
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Anders Green
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Re: Well since this will be overlooked elsewhere...
November 04, 2007 09:45PM
webkris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks Anders!
> Thanks for taking the time to update the rules and
> post the break out. We often get pointed to an
> obscure PDF or even an FIA document - and we
> appreciate you taking the time to break it all
> down.

You're welcome. smiling smiley I think that a read of the changes shows lots of little things that make the rules easier and clearer for the competitors and more flexible for the organizers. All year long we're building a list of rules changes and bouncing the ideas off the NRS organizers to see what they think. I think it will be a good year. smiling smiley

And if anyone has any rule change ideas, email them to me. Advance warning: my area of expertise is event operations, not car building or car class stuff.

Cheers,
Anders




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JohnLane
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Re: Well since this will be overlooked elsewhere...
November 06, 2007 08:46PM
Anders,

Thank you for your efforts at getting this out for all who need to know of such things.

I will be running only NASA events due in part to the lack of requirement for H&N restraints and the better atmosphere at NASA events.

'08 Doo-Wops running under NASA sanction made the difference between my Volvo getting the attention it needs and it continuing to be another unused rallycar sitting in the corner.

John Lane



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