belts?

Two comments:

Sparcos/Sabelts will not reset and will stay open if you twist them far enough. If you only twist a little bit, they will return to the "closed" position though. Also, if you twist them carefully, they will just unlock the shoulders and not the lap part. I like that because sometimes I just need to unlock the shoulders, like if I forgot to swing my door partially closed before belting in (although I'm getting pretty good at fishing it closed with my foot).

Clip-ins are fine, but don't forget to put in the cotter pins. I've started carrying a pile with me when I do scrutineering because so many people seem to forget them.

---

Self-righteous douche canoe

hoche Wrote:
>
> Clip-ins are fine, but don't forget to put in the
> cotter pins. I've started carrying a pile with me
> when I do scrutineering because so many people
> seem to forget them.
>


I always removed the cotter pins before going to tech at STPR. For several years in a row, the tech inspectors there weren't happy unless they caught something wrong with your car.

If nothing was wrong, they'd make something up (like putting roll bar padding down the a-pillars to obstruct your view...and charge you double for the padding...seriously). By giving them something easy to find, it saved a lot of headaches.

Just replaced the pins after tech if they didn't find them missing. (Usually they did, and then felt all proud that they saved my life.)

Oops, my secret's out. Better loosen 1 lugnut per wheel if I ever go to STPR again...they're onto my cotter pin scheme.

---

Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/25/2008 09:54AM by Lurch.

Lurch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I always removed the cotter pins before going to
> tech at STPR. For several years in a row, the
> tech inspectors there weren't happy unless they
> caught something wrong with your car.

That's...broken. Scrutineers shouldn't be adversarial, they
should be there to make sure your car is safe.

---

Self-righteous douche canoe

I've heard that story from someone other than Lurch. It's not any way for scrutineering to be ran. I booted a car for expired belts a couple years ago and then offered to go home and get my NIB belts and loan them , but I wouldn't sell them to him. I haven't even sold a cage in 2 years to avoid any conflicts of interest.

adversarial is unfortunately the only way that works. It ain't so bad. I'd rather have a hard-ass inspector anyway.

-Alberto

alkun Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> adversarial is unfortunately the only way that
> works. It ain't so bad. I'd rather have a hard-ass
> inspector anyway.
>
> -Alberto

Alberto, you do not understand. Nit-picking on totally unimportant things NOT written in the book , playing games ("That fire extinguisher won't do, has to have a metal gauge" ---so you scamble to find a metal guaged bottle" THEN they say "That mount won't do, has to be metal."--- so you find a metal one and THEN "That mount won't do, has to have 2 latches" etc is total bullshit.

And hard ass only works is if is PERFECT and NON-Discrimatory and even then there is NO NEED for hard ass.

Sharp yes, but hard ass---as in acting adversarial is counter productive.
Just like when you get a fucking cop who has forgotten what the purpose of traffic patrols are and makes it into a chance for him to display his simple POWER over you, hard, made up "violations" and adversarial attitudes merely breeds contempt of the person acting the ass and the process.

STPR is infamous for ENDLESS CHICKENSHIT.

---

Monika Hawkinson
Seattle, WA

We got dinged for the driver's left side lap belt being secured to the stock seat mount point (where the seat bracket was also connected). Fortunately, Marcel found a mount point on the chassis just below the sill and it passed.

Seems they didn't care about the safety of the codriver since that seat was secured the same way and wasn't flagged. Interestingly, we passed STPR tech in 2007 in exactly the same configuration.

We suspected something might be up when they tut-tutted at our NRS log book.

Simon

---

Simon Wright
Owner/Driver USUK Racing - Home of the USUK Racing LED Light Bars!

North America Rally Map

Yeah, I understand. I deal with building inspectors all the time. Unfortunately, inspectors are people, and as far as I have figured, about a third of humans are just dicks. Like cops, inspectors have a hard job, they are responsible for important stuff. If you go into it asuming they are going to be dicks, they often are.

There is adversarial arguing like they do in science and engineering, and adversarial power tripping, unfortuately the alternative to an adversarial system is huge bureaucracy.

I'm sure there are infuriating assholes out there, and I'll probably eat my words, but so far all I've experienced is helpful folks donating their time.

-Berto

So Simon, was there any explanation as to why this was not OK? Bolt too small? Twist in the belt? Anything specific as to how it could fail? Interesting, as a number of belts can be seen mounted to a frame to which the seat and seat mounts are attached. And FIA says that the belts cannot be mounted to the seats or the seat supports; placing the belt on the same bolt as the seat mount does not seem to violate that as long as the load goes directly to the bolt, and not through the seat support. However, sometimes seat mount bolts are smallish, so maybe that was the issue.

Regards,
Mark B.

I vaguely recall the argument being made that in an impact the seat might move or break free of its moorings at which point the lap belt is no longer securing me. It occurs to me that with the belt now attached to the chassis if the seat breaks free my hips are going to get some crushing from the belt. There was no issue with the inside lap belt being attached to the seat mount. AS you know (since you had me change the reinforcing plates) the antisub (crotch-crusher) belts are bolted through the floor below the seat.

We were keen to get through tech as you might expect so we acquiesced. And I'm sure the inspector, bless his cotton socks, had our best interests at heart. :-)

Re-reading your post, Mark, there's a chance the belt may have been attached to an eyebolt on the seat bracket and not directly to the stock mount bolt so the FIA type rule may have applied. The car's not here right now so I can't go out and look at it.

It does seem that codrivers are apparently not affected by this scenario :-D

Simon

---

Simon Wright
Owner/Driver USUK Racing - Home of the USUK Racing LED Light Bars!

North America Rally Map



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2008 07:00PM by simoniac.

That's the argument.
Of course, in my opinion (which doesn't matter to anyone really but my dog), if the seat mount breaks in an accident there's probably some pretty bad stuff happening regardless and since the seat could now move, the belts will become loose no matter what they are bolted too.

---

Grant Hughes

alkun Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> adversarial is unfortunately the only way that
> works. It ain't so bad. I'd rather have a hard-ass
> inspector anyway.
>
> -Alberto

Oh, really?


You must like building cages for that Volvo. Shall we go for three?

---

Self-righteous douche canoe

hoche Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> alkun Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > adversarial is unfortunately the only way
> that
> > works. It ain't so bad. I'd rather have a
> hard-ass
> > inspector anyway.
> >
> > -Alberto
>
> Oh, really?
>
>
> You must like building cages for that Volvo. Shall
> we go for three?
>
>

Ignore that guy...just because he owns the car doesn't mean he knows anything This cage is quite nice and I'm not putting another one in there.

When are you going to come by and logbook this thing anyway?

Tim

heymagic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've heard that story from someone other than
> Lurch. It's not any way for scrutineering to be
> ran. I booted a car for expired belts a couple
> years ago and then offered to go home and get my
> NIB belts and loan them , but I wouldn't sell them
> to him. I haven't even sold a cage in 2 years to
> avoid any conflicts of interest.


reasons why Gene is a badass.

he hooks EVERYONE up. Keep working that Magic.

---

-Tom
DemonRallyTeam | Fine Tuning | CTS Turbo & RP Turbos | RalleyTuned | JRM | Meister Autowerks
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Add us on Facebook | Next Event: 2013 Olympus Rally June 22-23 Olympia, WA

Bring it on, honky. I'll wear my arguing pants. Anyway, The big guy from oaktown did some top shelf work.

-Al



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2008 11:51PM by alkun.