General musings on 4-piston brake upgrades

Got the file. I'll try importing it in the morning. Thank you.

I can narrow the model to make it the .810 model.

I just use these on the front. I use Mazdaspeed Protege stuff on the back (solid 11" with single piston)...it is just front wheel drive afterall.

I can see beefier stuff for rwd and awd apps.

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Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan

Hello All! It's my first time posting over here.

I've been working on a similar brake kit for about the past 2 months. My progress so far. I'm a student at Humboldt State University in NorCal. This is my first crack at solid modeling. Still figuring out all the tricks.

My kit is going in the direction that Tim was originally for the front, except utilizing a 2 piston caliper and a solid rotor on the rear. All to fit under my 15" wheels.

Just thought I'd share my progress so far, I still have a long long way to go.

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Michael LeCompte



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2007 04:05AM by pikespeakgtx.

Hi PikesPeakGTX,

You may want to reconsider your brake rotor choice. I use those exact same rotors on my road racing car, and I recently found out they were discontinued by Wilwood. You might want to design around something else!

Bob

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Opel is a 4-letter word...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10498579@N07/sets/

Thanks,

I am aware that they are discontinuued.

I found the last two from a company in ohio sitting on a shelf.

I have no other choice really because of time constraints for my class, I'm in too deep already.

With the sort of driving I do, and the pad compound I chose, these rotors should last a while.

I'm going to keep my eyes open for a backup pair, but I've already spoken to Mark @ wilwood about it and he's got a guy who makes custom rotors that size for around 150 bucks each. When that Bridge comes I'll just have to cross it.

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Michael LeCompte

pikespeakgtx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks,
>
> I am aware that they are discontinuued.
>
> I found the last two from a company in ohio
> sitting on a shelf.

What??? You knew they were discontinued and you still went that way?


>
> I have no other choice really because of time
> constraints for my class, I'm in too deep
> already.
>
> With the sort of driving I do, and the pad
> compound I chose, these rotors should last a
> while.
>
> I'm going to keep my eyes open for a backup pair,
> but I've already spoken to Mark @ wilwood about it
> and he's got a guy who makes custom rotors that
> size for around 150 bucks each. When that Bridge
> comes I'll just have to cross it.

I have one spare for you. I bought it to check the fit in the first design iteration...before I decided that it was a bad idea. You can have if you want to come pick it up.

Tim

I said before that Wilwood is the only one who makes pads for the Dynapro. Hawk is working on an HT-10 (Great rally pad) for this caliper but it isn't in production yet. Spring?

However, I tried a Raybestos pad that is made for the Dynapro from Porterfield Brakes. Worked super well at LSPR. Very little rotor wear (imperceptible), very good wide temp range. Didn't overheat like the Polymatrix pads did.

We milled some shallow slots into the back of the backing plates to get more air circulation around and into the pistons. This may have helped our overheating issue as well.

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Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan

Finished up the wheel today. Good enough.

I got the profile of the inner side of the spoke as close as I could without a contour gauge. Ended up setting the zoom to scale and using a transparency taped to my monitor and tracing the profile.

I don't know how much I can trust it. I'll plan on making the rotor hat extra thick and facing it once I know for sure how much clearance is between the caliper and the wheel. If I'm lucky I'll be able to rapid prototype the rotor hat and find out exactly how thick it needs to be, then I won't have to face my actual rotor hats.

The wheel manufacturer discontinued this wheel a while ago and no longer has drawings, so I did the best I could.

Thanks Tim for the hub file. I started on it, prolly finish it tomorrow.
You don't have a rear hub done yet do you?

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Michael LeCompte

Mike,

I was looking back thru my notes and before you waste any more time I thought you might like to know why the 160-2397 rotor is such a bad idea. Take a look at this picture:



The green rotor is the 160-2397 that you're trying to use and the purple one is the one I'm using. Please note how the mounting tabs on your rotor overlap the flange on the WHEEL STUDS!!!!! There is no rotor hat than can fix that situation. You can't turn down the spindle flange enough to make that rotor work without compromising the integrity of the stud holes.

The only way that rotor works is if you make the rotor hat a negative extension that bolts to the back of the stock spindle the way the current rotors do. Please see the silly stock car wide-5 hub on the lower right. This is a bad idea...stop now.

I can not be STOPPED!!!

I'm way too hard headed.

I already know about the situation you are describing. I remember the night I realized it and the anxiety that coursed through my veins and the head scratching that followed.

It's probably going to have to mount like a factory rotor because the the I.D. of the tabs on my rotors is smaller than the O.D. of a stock hub. Course I'll still have to run a wheel spacer to clear the wilwood "B" dimension of the caliper.

I promise it won't be a silly extension jobie like on that wide 5 hub. Remember the rotor tabs are on one face of the rotor so I can flip it over and gain clearance if needed and/or I can always make countersinks for the lug stud bosses.


There is still a possibility of turning down the stock hubs slightly and rotating the mounting tabs of the rotor in the correct position in relation to hub ears and putting the lug stud holes in the correct rotational location compared the rotor tabs and Presto! It slides right on. Don't laugh, it might be possible.

Absolute worst case is a 2 piece rotor hat.

These mutherfuckers are going on there.

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Michael LeCompte

pikespeakgtx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> It's probably going to have to mount like a
> factory rotor because the the I.D. of the tabs on
> my rotors is smaller than the O.D. of a stock hub.
> Course I'll still have to run a wheel spacer to
> clear the wilwood "B" dimension of the caliper.
>

Really, by my measurements you're going to be running about 3/4" of wheel spacer and then another 1/2" of spacer/brake hat on the backside of the spindle to make it fit. And it will only mount by bolting the rotor hat to the backside of the spindle. You're still stuck with disemboweling the wheel bearings every time you want to work on the brakes...where exactly is the improvement?



> I promise it won't be a silly extension jobie like
> on that wide 5 hub. Remember the rotor tabs are on
> one face of the rotor so I can flip it over and
> gain clearance if needed

Huh, flipping it over doesn't get you anywhere.


and/or I can always make
> countersinks for the lug stud bosses.
>

So now you're designing for custom modified discontinued rotors...thing very hard about this...



>
> There is still a possibility of turning down the
> stock hubs slightly and rotating the mounting tabs
> of the rotor in the correct position in relation
> to hub ears and putting the lug stud holes in the
> correct rotational location compared the rotor
> tabs and Presto! It slides right on. Don't laugh,
> it might be possible.
>

It is possible (in fact I played with the idea for a couple of hours) to make a spindle shaped extension that bolts onto the backside of a turned down hub/spindle that will let you mount your rotors. You have to fish the rotor over the spindle at an angle with everything loose then bolt it all together. Perhaps this link might help:

http://www.rube-goldberg.com/



> Absolute worst case is a 2 piece rotor hat.
>
> These mutherfuckers are going on there.
>


I'm not saying that it can't be done. Like many other unnatural acts it is possible...but it's still a fucking stupid idea. Best if luck though.

What else am I going to do? Buy new wheels?

---

Michael LeCompte



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/2007 11:02PM by pikespeakgtx.

pikespeakgtx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What else am I going to do? Buy new wheels?
>
>
>
>
> Edited 1 times. Last edit at Nov 16, 2007 by
> pikespeakgtx.


Hard so say without seeing the cross section of your wheels. Send me a file and I'll check it against my stuff. I just think you're painting yourself into a corner and it will be a waste of time and money.

sent your aol.com address

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Michael LeCompte

Dude, your work is awesome. I wish my 3d modeling was this good. I can't wait to get back into school....

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Welcome to the cult of JVL drink the koolaid or be banned.

Mike send some sort of universal format like a parasolid .xt or an .igs file. I don't have anything that will open an Inventor file. Looks like there's plenty of room though depending on the inside profile of your rim.