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2003 Neon Project

Posted by badcamber 
NoCoast
Grant Hughes
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 27, 2012 05:54PM
Dry ice works for the sound deadening tar sheets on the inside of cars and is cheaper and more readily available to most people than Liquid Nitrogen. Dave would know exactly, but I think it ended up being 300-350 per car to do his BMW and my Merkur with liquid nitrogen... I doesn't work for the undercoating or seam sealer though really.

When I say don't bother with seam welding I mean don't strip the entire car down and try to weld all the seams. Common sense dictates stitching around the strut towers and probably any other easily accessible and cleaned seam. Don't make it into more than a weekend day or two project though. Definitely don't make it into a six monther.



Grant Hughes
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DaveK
Dave Kern
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 27, 2012 06:18PM
Quote
NoCoast
Dry ice works for the sound deadening tar sheets on the inside of cars and is cheaper and more readily available to most people than Liquid Nitrogen. Dave would know exactly, but I think it ended up being 300-350 per car to do his BMW and my Merkur with liquid nitrogen.

It was $950 for two cars (hooray for keeping track of numbers). AirGas charged us near retail rates since we don't do any real volume with them. If I had to do it again, it seemed to work well, but there was still some real time involved "finishing" the work that we weren't able to do with the nitrogen. Considering the man hours involved, if an acid bath is available somewhere nearby, I'd go that route even at 2-3x the cost.

Of course, for a first rally build, I'd just stitch weld the engine bay any some seams that are already easy to get to on the inside and call it good. I guess if you're after some welding practice, stich welding isn't a bad place to get some time under the helmet.

Dave
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sidewaez
Blake Lind
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 01:23AM
Quote
DaveK
It was $950 for two cars...

holy shit!?
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 01:45AM
Quote
sidewaez
Quote
DaveK
It was $950 for two cars...

holy shit!?

Yeah the price for the Dewar depend of a lotta stuff, and using it effciently takes some care...
I reckonded 1.5 cans, less than $300/car but it was fast and easy.
That counts.



John Vanlandingham
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czwalga
steve czwalga
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 05:56AM
I dunno $25 bucks worth of dry ice, cover the tar for 20 min or so, beat it with a sledge hammer. Had it all gone in a few hours at most.


If the liquid nitrogen got rid of the rubber shit on all the edges of the body panels, I think it would be worth it.
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sidewaez
Blake Lind
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 10:54AM
We do a fair amount of quantity with our welding supply at work and he said he wouldn't charge me for the dewar, but how big of one would I need?
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DaveK
Dave Kern
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 11:04AM
Quote
czwalga
If the liquid nitrogen got rid of the rubber shit on all the edges of the body panels, I think it would be worth it.

The LN was used to remove the rubberized undercoating from the entire bottom and wheel wells of the car. There's a whole bunch of pictures in the BMW Compact build thread on here, or you can follow this link to see more if anyone's curious.



FWIW, the little patches of tar stuff are cake compared to the undercoating. Some cars would not really benefit from the full LN treatment, like the Evo for instance. The undercoating on that was a thin tar like thing that was just taken off with a wire wheel. The Evo would still benefit from LN on any seams that are gooped up.

If we did it again, we'd be more efficient for sure, but for a car as loaded up in rubber as the BMW, I'd still say grabbing a 255L dewar is the way to go. If you have extra when you're done, you can always freeze some random stuff and throw it against the floor to see it shatter (keep in mind its better to do this AFTER the real project is done so you don't run out with one corner of the trunk still left to do...Mark Malsom!)



Dave
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john vanlandingham
John Vanlandingham
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 01:01PM
Quote
czwalga
I dunno $25 bucks worth of dry ice, cover the tar for 20 min or so, beat it with a sledge hammer. Had it all gone in a few hours at most.


If the liquid nitrogen got rid of the rubber shit on all the edges of the body panels, I think it would be worth it.

I dunno for those sheets of whatever glued inside with the liquid, it was less than 20 minutes of easy tapping with a welding chip hammer and it was all gone. But that wasn't the point.

The RUBBERIZED undercoating and RUBBERIZED SEAM goop on Xratties if 100% coverage under the car and in the wheelarches and in some places over 1/2" thick or more. Seconds and it looks like DaveK's piccie, easy tapping.,,
In seams the goop loses its grip and MOST jumps out when tapped, some clings a bit but falls out when poked.


Blake! depends on how much shit is slathered on. A Xratty deffo more than one 175L can, but say a Fuckus, maybe half a can.
Depends.

But look at those piccies. Ready to weld (that's "Weld Thru Primer"winking smiley



John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

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CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.
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czwalga
steve czwalga
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 02:16PM
Yeah I agree, if the liquid works for those rubber goop it would probably be worth it depending on what your budget is.
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Mad Matt F
Matt Follett
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Re: 2003 Neon Project
November 28, 2012 02:41PM
Montreal in Feburary...

Frozen car, frozen suspension, potholes from hell. Done.

Something about cold enough to freeze nuts off a steel bridge, that's all I know.
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