Cage pics & Shoulder harness mount question

Building this car for Canadian rally, CARS rules.

I recently got the cage all welded in my 2002 Impreza TS, and have a question about the shoulder belts. The rule book says they must go in a downwards direction, and form an angle between 10 degrees and 45 degrees from the upper rim of the backrest. The main hoop horizontal bar is too high, it creates an upwards angle of the belts from the seat holes. However, there is a rear strut bar here:



Would this work? Or is it too far back? I don't see anything in the rulebook about how long the belts can be, only about the angles.

Also how does the rest of the cage look?

It appears to be missing either a V or X in the back stays. Also needs gussets on the door bar Xs.

You can use that bar between the towers for harnesses, however with HANS devices now it's strongly recommended that the belts be as short as possible to limit the chance of the belts coming off the HANS in a multiple impact accident. Make sure you cross the belts behind the seats when you put them in.

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Ryan Huber
VA3AWD

Also make sure they are long enough to wrap them properly and "lock" them in.

Tim.

Are the V/X backstays required? I couldn't find anything about that, then again finding any information about proper cage installation is hard. It's like reading law.

Door X bar gussets are required? I thought only the gussets I have already are required - I'll confirm with the log book guy. No problem to add them if we need them.

Also I just measured the distance to the rear strut bar and it's not enough to install the harness there. Going to have to weld in a new bar somewhere..

Here's a smart solution:

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

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Read harness rules again. Fia says 0-10 degrees recommended, 45 max. Rally America says max of ten. Had to redo one door bar due to that...
Gussets in all x junctions, so yes to door bar gussets.
Rear x or v not required in RA, required in NASA, not sure for cars. It'd only be x allowed based on root bars...
Bent bar behind plane of main hoop. Check for Tyler's build for pic.

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Grant Hughes

Rear X or V only required for NRS if you don't follow 253 . If you do halo hoop or some other variation the backstay bars bars are required. Confusing rules..Anders fault.

Talk with your local scrutineer on the seat belt issue before any big mods are done. have you had the seats mounted in the car?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/24/2013 10:12AM by heymagic.

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heymagic
Rear X or V only required for NRS if you don't follow 253 . If you do halo hoop or some other variation the backstay bars bars are required. Confusing rules..Anders fault.

Talk with your local scrutineer on the seat belt issue before any big mods are done. have you had the seats mounted in the car?

NRS rulebook lacks the allowance for dom when cage is built to FIA 253 spec and given lack of availability of affordable CDS in the states, the 'Built to 253 specs' in NRS book is pointless. I have a customer car that was base spec without a V or X in rear that I have to add it in because he's getting a NASA logbook.

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Grant Hughes

Since the cage is basically done, why not add a simple harness bar? eg (my car, mid painting)

The NRS 'bracing in the backstays' thing has been in there since about 10 years ago; Gene and I were part of the tream that reviewed these rules 5-6 years ago, so it is not news to anyone who has been involved. You can use a single diagonal rather than an X or a V.

Eric's solution is pretty good; it allows you set the set the harness anchor height just right and manage differences in height etc.

Mark B.

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starion887
The NRS 'bracing in the backstays' thing has been in there since about 10 years ago; Gene and I were part of the tream that reviewed these rules 5-6 years ago, so it is not news to anyone who has been involved. You can use a single diagonal rather than an X or a V.

Eric's solution is pretty good; it allows you set the set the harness anchor height just right and manage differences in height etc.

Mark B.

I'll add that i wouldn't build a cage withOUT something in the backstays even tho it is allowed, 253 or not.

Edit..doh..in my feebel brane that said 'without' . There is an ink shortage and the last 1/2 the word didn't print. Totally changes the meaning of the post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/30/2013 09:55AM by heymagic.

I would but I am not as bright as Gene!

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starion887
I would but I am not as bright as Gene!

You might be more awake tho..

I wouldn't build a cage WITHOUT something in the backstays, allowed or not. man I old guy'd that post.

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NoCoast
NRS rulebook lacks the allowance for dom when cage is built to FIA 253 spec and given lack of availability of affordable CDS in the states, the 'Built to 253 specs' in NRS book is pointless. I have a customer car that was base spec without a V or X in rear that I have to add it in because he's getting a NASA logbook.

Grant, I got CDS a few years ago at a good price (around $4 per foot) so it is feasible. It is not always available, but if you are building a light car, it is worth it to use the smaller sizes allowed by 253 with CDS.

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heymagic

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starion887
I would but I am not as bright as Gene!

You might be more awake tho..

I wouldn't build a cage WITHOUT something in the backstays, allowed or not. man I old guy'd that post.

Actually, I wouldn't either, but I had the urge to be facetious....

I guess that my real point is that it is the least useful brace in the whole cage structure and a single brace does a lot in both directions. So the lack of a rear backstay brace in certain cage rules sets doesn't bother me...

But the lack of sill bars in some rules sets DOES bother me.

Mark B.