Autocrossing a Rally Car

So on a lark I'm taking our rally car out to an AutoSlalom next weekend. I haven't done any slaloming in ages, and then mostly in Civics and Miatas. We're pretty much just going out for shits and giggles and to spread the word/awareness of our building stage rally series, so I'm really not expecting to do much, especially since the only non-gravel tires I have are some truly awful Federal brand All Seasons that came from the dealer on my Wife's Impreza.

Anyway, its a 2000 Impreza RS Production 4WD car, so the only mods of consequence are the cage and the Hotbits DT1s. Any recommendations for settings and tire pressures for a fairly tight course? On the Civic with adjustables I'd stiffen the front full hard and the rears almost full soft. On the Miata I didn't have adjustables but I ran a big front sway and no rear sway which worked well. Adjusting the suspension, tire pressures and maybe disconnecting a bar is about as far as I'm willing to go on this little adventure.

Any suggestions? I'm expecting more hilarity than anything else.

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Atlantic Canadian Region Rallysport: http://www.rallyeast.ca - Ledwidge Lookoff Rally http://www.lookoffrally.com
2000 Impreza 2.5RS CARS P4WD (Sponsored by Rally-Tech, Great North Performance)

Run on an old set of gravel tires and REALLY enjoy yourself.

You'll be seriously outclassed anyways, might as well hoon some fun.

Considered it, but don't want to chew up any of the sets we have. Trust me, these Federals will provide a decidedly rally-like lack of traction.

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Atlantic Canadian Region Rallysport: http://www.rallyeast.ca - Ledwidge Lookoff Rally http://www.lookoffrally.com
2000 Impreza 2.5RS CARS P4WD (Sponsored by Rally-Tech, Great North Performance)

"Soften" the end that pushes the worst. (shock settings, tire pressures, etc.)

They're crapasstic tires, who gives a fawk if you roll 'em over onto the sidewalls, right?

"If you can live with body-roll, softer suspension gives more grip" (paraphrase) True with Asphlat as it is with teh Gravellys.....

If it pushes hard-enough (think "F-Stock Mustang" ), do all your braking, THEN turn-in. Of course, you don't have 300-400hp to power back out again, I'm guessing.

---

Parfois, on fait pas semblant!

I am:
I know:
I am from:

Nobody.
Nothing.
Nowhere.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2013 10:18PM by Creech.

Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally.

From my experiences with an 01 2.5RS, I'd say start at about 42F 38R cold, and then as you get comfortable with the grip and the tires and surface warm up, take it either down to 40F 37-38R from wherever it lands, or up to 42F 40R. Depends heavily on the surface and how it feels.

I wouldn't disconnect a bar. The Impreza normally isn't tail happy, and you'll want the rear bar to get any decent rotation on the tight parts. If you aren't getting the rotation, I'd take the tire pressures up a bit in rear until you do.

Don't expect to ever be able to use those tires again if it's asphalt. Tight corners on warm asphalt with high pressures on AS tend to look like you took a tire groover and went crazy all over the outer 1/8th or so of the tread.

Quote
si
Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward, _{chosen because he represents all the collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)} will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally _{because of the aforementioned collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)}

From my experiences with an 01 2.5RS, I'd say start at about 42F 38R cold, and then as you get comfortable with the grip and the tires and surface warm up, take it either down to 40F 37-38R from wherever it lands, or up to 42F 40R. Depends heavily on the surface and how it feels.

I wouldn't disconnect a bar. The Impreza normally isn't tail happy, and you'll want the rear bar to get any decent rotation on the tight parts. If you aren't getting the rotation, I'd take the tire pressures up a bit in rear until you do.

Don't expect to ever be able to use those tires again if it's asphalt. Tight corners on warm asphalt with high pressures on AS tend to look like you took a tire groover and went crazy all over the outer 1/8th or so of the tread, but that's OK. Auto cross is cheap--and accessible, all you need to do is spend a fortune destroying tires and never mention it--so if you go and rip up tires rememeber not to break from the prepared script.

(groan) (attempt at explaining why--since we know the what already)

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

Quote
si
Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally.

Meanwhile, I did that and got thumbs-up from corner workers and event officials, with just the light admonishment that they didn't care what I did since i wasn't hitting cones.

---

Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

as for the drifting, etc, the small club I occasionally do an autox with once in a while just rolls their eyes and tells the worrywarts "rally driver" when one of us shows up

as long as we aren't using the course for drift practice and don't to it intentionally on every single turn, they typically don't get upset

though I have been talked to for getting too sideways too close to the timing gear

Quote
john vanlandingham

Quote
si
Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward,

Quote
JV
chosen because he represents all the collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)

will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally

Quote
JV
because of the aforementioned collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)

From my experiences with an 01 2.5RS, I'd say start at about 42F 38R cold, and then as you get comfortable with the grip and the tires and surface warm up, take it either down to 40F 37-38R from wherever it lands, or up to 42F 40R. Depends heavily on the surface and how it feels.

I wouldn't disconnect a bar. The Impreza normally isn't tail happy, and you'll want the rear bar to get any decent rotation on the tight parts. If you aren't getting the rotation, I'd take the tire pressures up a bit in rear until you do.

Don't expect to ever be able to use those tires again if it's asphalt. Tight corners on warm asphalt with high pressures on AS tend to look like you took a tire groover and went crazy all over the outer 1/8th or so of the tread, but that's OK. Auto cross is cheap--and accessible, all you need to do is spend a fortune destroying tires and never mention it--so if you go and rip up tires rememeber not to break from the prepared script.

(groan) (attempt at explaining why--since we know the what already)

As a long-time Solo Safety Steward, as well as an Instructor - I have to say you are talking out of your arse, John. The ONLY job of the SSS is to ensure the safety of the course (i.e. it meets guidelines for runoff and collision hazards), and the Safety of Spectators and Participants.

Somebody Hooning a bit too-much on-course? NOT the SSS' job to call him/her on it.

Someone's Hooning gets "out of hand", and they get a bit too close to the crowd (or Courseworkers) or grid/paddock and parked vehicles? Shut'erdown-Time, son.

TEH EDITZ:

SSS is a Volunteer position - it carries no "power", has a crapload of responsibility (when shyte goes all upside-down: sometimes Literally), and is essentially Thankless. But then, you probably already know everything there is to know about all of that, as you participate regularly and are likely an SSS in your local club yourself; Right?

I mean, how else would you have your finger on the pulse of exactly what goes on at every fucking single fucking grassroots fucking event, all-over the goddam fucking world, right John?

---

Parfois, on fait pas semblant!

I am:
I know:
I am from:

Nobody.
Nothing.
Nowhere.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2013 03:15PM by Creech.

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12xalt
as for the drifting, etc, the small club I occasionally do an autox with once in a while just rolls their eyes and tells the worrywarts "rally driver" when one of us shows up

as long as we aren't using the course for drift practice and don't to it intentionally on every single turn, they typically don't get upset

though I have been talked to for getting too sideways too close to the timing gear

Generally Same-Same at all the places I play. A couple of years-ago at KC at the driver training center, at one event I didn't have anyone in my class to "square off against", so I just tried new things. Got mad-props for goin' El Dorifto on my runs around this huge, 240-degree increasing-radius curve they had set up.

I am NOT the fastest or bestest driver out on the course - but more than one person HAS told me that I am always entertaining to watch. I'm there to have fun, that's all I know about it.

---

Parfois, on fait pas semblant!

I am:
I know:
I am from:

Nobody.
Nothing.
Nowhere.

Quote
Creech
As a long-time Solo Safety Steward, as well as an Instructor - I have to say you are talking out of your arse. The ONLY job of the SSS is to ensure the safety of the course (i.e. it meets guidelines for runoff and collision hazards), and the Safety of Spectators and Participants.

Somebody Hooning a bit too-much on-course? NOT the SSS' job to call him/her on it.

Someone's Hooning gets "out of hand", and they get a bit too close to the crowd (or Courseworkers) or grid/paddock and parked vehicles? Shut'erdown-Time, son.

Me? I neither intended to condone or disparage the practice. I'm only speaking from experience in the 2 regions I have done events with (St. Louis and Chicago). What you say is fair - the lots have hard obstacles (light posts, barriers, fences, timing equipment) and are always limited on space. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone drift a corner completely (without attempting to stop the drift and regain traction) and not get at least a talking to after the finish.

I have only seen 2 people asked to not return, and both were self-proclaimed drifters who were being very obviously reckless and on more than one corner caused the course workers to flee.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2013 02:00PM by si.

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Creech
more than one person HAS told me that I am always entertaining to watch. I'm there to have fun, that's all I know about it.

that's what I usually get at the autoX. "You know this isn't dirt? right?" have autosnoozed the rally car a bunch since there used to be an event 0.5 mi from the house. I would set your tires to about 40psi to start and don't change anything else (not worth the effort). if you want a tire marker on the sidewalls will give a quick indication if you need to go up or down in pressure. the drifting issue usually depends on if you appear out of control or not.

---

-KTurner
Stomp down on the exhilarator and hold on to the wheel.

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si

Quote
Creech
As a long-time Solo Safety Steward, as well as an Instructor - I have to say you are talking out of your arse. The ONLY job of the SSS is to ensure the safety of the course (i.e. it meets guidelines for runoff and collision hazards), and the Safety of Spectators and Participants.

Somebody Hooning a bit too-much on-course? NOT the SSS' job to call him/her on it.

Someone's Hooning gets "out of hand", and they get a bit too close to the crowd (or Courseworkers) or grid/paddock and parked vehicles? Shut'erdown-Time, son.

Me? I neither intended to condone or disparage the practice. I'm only speaking from experience in the 2 regions I have done events with (St. Louis and Chicago). What you say is fair - the lots have hard obstacles (light posts, barriers, fences, timing equipment) and are always limited on space. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone drift a corner completely (without attempting to stop the drift and regain traction) and not get at least a talking to after the finish.

I have only seen 2 people asked to not return, and both were self-proclaimed drifters who were being very obviously reckless and on more than one corner caused the course workers to flee.

Not you - Mr. Vanlandingdammitalltohellman's "interjections".

Sorry, it looks like it was addressing you because of the teeny tiny script he used figuring it would be overlooked, except by maybe Morison or one of the other people he wars with constantly.

(no offense to you here either, Keith)

---

Parfois, on fait pas semblant!

I am:
I know:
I am from:

Nobody.
Nothing.
Nowhere.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2013 02:31PM by Creech.

Quote
Creech

Generally Same-Same at all the places I play. A couple of years-ago at KC at the driver training center, at one event I didn't have anyone in my class to "square off against", so I just tried new things. Got mad-props for goin' El Dorifto on my runs around this huge, 240-degree increasing-radius curve they had set up.

I am NOT the fastest or bestest driver out on the course - but more than one person HAS told me that I am always entertaining to watch. I'm there to have fun, that's all I know about it.

my brother is usually the entertaining one at autox because he'll show up in and run anything (including his wife's tahoe)

Last time I ran (in my stock protege5 with all seasons on it) I was told I had the best launch of the day. I'll take it!

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Creech

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si

Quote
Creech
As a long-time Solo Safety Steward, as well as an Instructor - I have to say you are talking out of your arse. The ONLY job of the SSS is to ensure the safety of the course (i.e. it meets guidelines for runoff and collision hazards), and the Safety of Spectators and Participants.

Somebody Hooning a bit too-much on-course? NOT the SSS' job to call him/her on it.

Someone's Hooning gets "out of hand", and they get a bit too close to the crowd (or Courseworkers) or grid/paddock and parked vehicles? Shut'erdown-Time, son.

Me? I neither intended to condone or disparage the practice. I'm only speaking from experience in the 2 regions I have done events with (St. Louis and Chicago). What you say is fair - the lots have hard obstacles (light posts, barriers, fences, timing equipment) and are always limited on space. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone drift a corner completely (without attempting to stop the drift and regain traction) and not get at least a talking to after the finish.

I have only seen 2 people asked to not return, and both were self-proclaimed drifters who were being very obviously reckless and on more than one corner caused the course workers to flee.

Not you - Mr. Vanlandingdammitalltohellman's "interjections".

Sorry, it looks like it was addressing you because of the teeny tiny script he used figuring it would be overlooked, except by maybe Morison or one of the other people he wars with constantly.

(no offense to you here either, Keith)

Awwww.
OK maybe there really aren't really perverts who pull wings off flies, but the whiny "you can't do THAT, it looks dangerous" BS is what the whole thing strikes me as--but its only based on 30 years of fleeting contact with "those sorts" so I'm probably wrong.
I mean if I wanted to spend a whole day listening to people whine about why "the other guys "have to be" cheating cause he beat me"
I could just find a gang of Microsoftie nerds sipping their lattes and listen to them

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.