Autocrossing a Rally Car

The Boise people get all uppity about drifting with the car guys. At least they were when I stopped going a few years ago. They never said anything to me when I would drift the hell out of my shifter kart though. I would intentionally slide the kart in some corners because it was faster for me. I sold the kart in 2010 and haven't been back though.

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Creech
(no offense to you here either, Keith)

None taken.

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First Rally: 2001
Driver (7), Co-Driver (44)
Drivers (16)
Clerk (10), Official (7), Volunteer (4)
Cars Built (1), Engines Built (0) Cages Built (0)
Last Updated, January 4, 2015

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john vanlandingham
Blame is for idiots. losers.

Here is how I handle the SS (safety stewards) at rallycrosses...

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alkun
Here is how I handle the SS (safety stewards) at rallycrosses...

An admirable method, more should follow your lead...

And a great epic motion picture..

---

John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

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alkun
Here is how I handle the SS (safety stewards) at rallycrosses...

I've been acting safety steward for several events this year (still need to file the paperwork for official status) but the only Nazi-ing that ever have to do is remind people to hold the red flag, it is useless when it is 20 feet away from you and there's a car that debeaded downcourse and the next car coming up is two gates from your position.

At least I got the new people to put down their smartphones when they're supposed to be working.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2013 06:59AM by Pete.

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john vanlandingham
...the safety steward, _{chosen because he represents all the collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)} ...

My experience is slightly different. When I showed up to my first autocross, driving a 30-year-old piece of shit from some place north of Denmark, they took one look at my car and handed me a honorary Safety Steward license. No leather or corn-flakes were involved.

A crossdresser in leather sounds kinda like a good time to me, how did I manage to miss that?

Borrow an old Saab or Volvo and head down to Seattle some Saturday night.

Bring your own corn flakes.

So since this was just about the only useful reply to this post...

I'm not worried about any real drift action. Its a pretty tight course. I've also been well involved in the local Slalom club for 10 years, I know what I can get away with.

Pressures sound about right, though a bit higher than I used to run. Not worried about these junky tires. Any suggestions on adjusting the Hotbits? Stiffen the fronts up to full, rears at 50% maybe? Thats what I was thinking for my starting point.

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si
Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally.

From my experiences with an 01 2.5RS, I'd say start at about 42F 38R cold, and then as you get comfortable with the grip and the tires and surface warm up, take it either down to 40F 37-38R from wherever it lands, or up to 42F 40R. Depends heavily on the surface and how it feels.

I wouldn't disconnect a bar. The Impreza normally isn't tail happy, and you'll want the rear bar to get any decent rotation on the tight parts. If you aren't getting the rotation, I'd take the tire pressures up a bit in rear until you do.

Don't expect to ever be able to use those tires again if it's asphalt. Tight corners on warm asphalt with high pressures on AS tend to look like you took a tire groover and went crazy all over the outer 1/8th or so of the tread.

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Atlantic Canadian Region Rallysport: http://www.rallyeast.ca - Ledwidge Lookoff Rally http://www.lookoffrally.com
2000 Impreza 2.5RS CARS P4WD (Sponsored by Rally-Tech, Great North Performance)

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Creech

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john vanlandingham

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si
Well, I can't speak to your local group/club/region of AutoX, but I can say that in the local SCCA events here, if you demonstrate any rally-like lack of traction and continue, the safety steward,

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JV
chosen because he represents all the collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)

will likely ask you to take a seat outside of your car. Generally it's not considered acceptably safe to drift a corner intentionally

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JV
because of the aforementioned collective timidity, rigid brainless obedience to the idea of rules, faggoty fussiness of frustrated cross-dressers and fear of being found out as a closet ________(something horrible involving leather and corn flakes)

From my experiences with an 01 2.5RS, I'd say start at about 42F 38R cold, and then as you get comfortable with the grip and the tires and surface warm up, take it either down to 40F 37-38R from wherever it lands, or up to 42F 40R. Depends heavily on the surface and how it feels.

I wouldn't disconnect a bar. The Impreza normally isn't tail happy, and you'll want the rear bar to get any decent rotation on the tight parts. If you aren't getting the rotation, I'd take the tire pressures up a bit in rear until you do.

Don't expect to ever be able to use those tires again if it's asphalt. Tight corners on warm asphalt with high pressures on AS tend to look like you took a tire groover and went crazy all over the outer 1/8th or so of the tread, but that's OK. Auto cross is cheap--and accessible, all you need to do is spend a fortune destroying tires and never mention it--so if you go and rip up tires rememeber not to break from the prepared script.

(groan) (attempt at explaining why--since we know the what already)

As a long-time Solo Safety Steward, as well as an Instructor - I have to say you are talking out of your arse, John. The ONLY job of the SSS is to ensure the safety of the course (i.e. it meets guidelines for runoff and collision hazards), and the Safety of Spectators and Participants.

Somebody Hooning a bit too-much on-course? NOT the SSS' job to call him/her on it.

Someone's Hooning gets "out of hand", and they get a bit too close to the crowd (or Courseworkers) or grid/paddock and parked vehicles? Shut'erdown-Time, son.

TEH EDITZ:

SSS is a Volunteer position - it carries no "power", has a crapload of responsibility (when shyte goes all upside-down: sometimes Literally), and is essentially Thankless. But then, you probably already know everything there is to know about all of that, as you participate regularly and are likely an SSS in your local club yourself; Right?

I mean, how else would you have your finger on the pulse of exactly what goes on at every fucking single fucking grassroots fucking event, all-over the goddam fucking world, right John?

Sorry Creech, I guess i must have just had the statistical impossiblity of nearly 90% of every single auto cross realted person I have ever had the misfortune have having my time wasted by was a major enormous, poor bullshitter and/or liar. Bullshitting about rules, bullshitting about set up, bullshitting about how anything and everything works on cars---it would be hilarious expect its all the same bullshit---and couching their results---habitually---in vaguer terms--to puff it up---just total know wankers..

Now it has to be some amazing anomaly because whenever I see auto-x people on-line they scream and yell and call names and cuss about how they are the warmest friendliest group of people in the whole world, veritable angels.. It's pretty funny--like "You fucking asshole it's greuling work racing autocross mere .0001 seconds separating victory and defeat you meanie, and we're the friendliest people you fuck nobody, you ought to come ourt and see us racing you'll see how friendly we are you fucker!!!

So I guess I just had bad luck that nearly every single one I ever met was a lying, bullshitting, cheating, POS, wanker...

That's some bad luck...

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.

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john vanlandingham
Now it has to be some amazing anomaly because whenever I see auto-x people on-line they scream and yell and call names and cuss about how they are the warmest friendliest group of people in the whole world, veritable angels.. It's pretty funny--like "You fucking asshole it's greuling work racing autocross mere .0001 seconds separating victory and defeat you meanie, and we're the friendliest people you fuck nobody, you ought to come ourt and see us racing you'll see how friendly we are you fucker!!!

Do you have any sense of irony at all?

To the thread-starter: when I was once forced to autocross an AWD DSM on snow-tires and stock suspension (long story, but it sounds close to what you'll be doing), the key was to ignore everything but the outside-front tire. As the Method actors say: "feel your outside-front tire; be your outside-front tire." I ran 40/35 to start and ended up leaving it there.

Just to be clear, there have been at least 3 deaths at AutoXs in the US.

I'd be surprised to find that JV had ever been to one in person.

I have seen a 911 spin and smack a light standard doing a fair ampount of damage to both car and light pole, which seemed a safe distance from the theoretical line.

JV your endless bashing of the people who actually get off their asses and volunteer time to put on events is quite tiring. How about you give it a rest and do your job working on parts for obsolete cars.

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OjNK
So since this was just about the only useful reply to this post...

I'm not worried about any real drift action. Its a pretty tight course. I've also been well involved in the local Slalom club for 10 years, I know what I can get away with.

Pressures sound about right, though a bit higher than I used to run. Not worried about these junky tires. Any suggestions on adjusting the Hotbits? Stiffen the fronts up to full, rears at 50% maybe? Thats what I was thinking for my starting point.

Don't know too much about the Hotbits, I would say set them however you would drive it on the street normally. It's awfully surface dependent, and the surfaces I've run in are far less than perfect. There's usually a few severe bumps/cracks, and a suspension should do what a suspension should do. I've never known adjustables to behave well at the extreme settings, but that just may be my experience with 'cheaper' adjustables.

On hot asphalt, I have to imagine your tires are going to be limiting enough that most everything else but the driver is going to be rather inconsequential.

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heymagic
Just to be clear, there have been at least 3 deaths at AutoXs in the US.

I'd be surprised to find that JV had ever been to one in person.

I have seen a 911 spin and smack a light standard doing a fair amount of damage to both car and light pole, which seemed a safe distance from the theoretical line.

JV your endless bashing of the people who actually get off their asses and volunteer time to put on events is quite tiring. How about you give it a rest and do your job working on parts for obsolete cars.

Hey Gene, why don't you bite me? I have been working on good parts for all kinds of cars---is it OK I work on 05 Subies? Or 03? a 90 something BMW?
Cause in the last week that was what I was doing...
Or are those obsolete for you?
What the fuck does the work I do have to do with observations about encounters i have had with anybody?

The observations were of a particular group of or type of person, a broad impression...people---I guess, but they didn't seem to be people that i would enjoy spending time with or around.
Weren't YOU ranting about Prius or Priapus owners?
Aren't they "people", too? Just like Corporations?

I have endured seeing one terribly, painfully boring 20 minutes of some cone-squish fest.. It was all I could bear watching since nothing interesting was happening. It just looked like some cars driving aimlessly around at slow speed in a sea of orange cones....
I guess its all what you're used to.
When somebody says "I won" and when in shock I ask "what, how?" and it takes nearly 20 minutes for the person to explain , eventually, that he won his class with only one other car that was first time person but considering the tilt of the earths axis, the angle of the sun---on and on...that he was within thousandths of a second of the WORLD RECORD blah blah
I ain't used to that---and when the Regional newsletter arrived and we see he was the slowest car overall except one...well that's typical in some places but I find that to be bullshit..

Sorry.

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John Vanlandingham
Sleezattle, WA, USA

Vive le Prole-le-ralliat

www.rallyrace.net/jvab
CALL +1 206 431-9696
Remember! Pacific Standard Time
is 3 hours behind Eastern Standard Time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2013 11:21PM by john vanlandingham.

autocross is painfully boring to watch

which is why when I go to one, I'm in the car, only way to have fun