Who do these goons AKA Rally America think they are

Saabfarm Wrote:
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> > Anders, Mark and Greg are doing a tremendous job
> in the NASA ESRC in keeping grassroots rally alive
> with no BS, well run, low cost events and great
> roads. Looking foward to another fun season.
>
> Btw, I was listening to an interview of Edwards
> and realized his voice is a dead ringer for Mark
> Bowers, uncanny.
>

Oh gawd. Can I get a voice transplant...for John Edwards, the 'Breck boy'?

MY brother is the liberal hippie; I'm the conservative red-neck in the famiily.....! Time to get some RedMan chewing tobacco bumper stickers.....

Mark B.

> Still images and footage may not be used for any
> commercial or retail purposes whatsoever, and may
> only be used for promotional purposes upon written
> permission of Rally America and the athlete(s)
> depicted in such image(s).

I hereby grant permission to all photographers to use my likeness in all press and communication...as long as it doesn't make me look silly.

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Lurch
Eric Burmeister
The west coast...of Michigan

Lurch Wrote:
> as long as it doesn't make me look silly.

Your just saying that because your lawyers are making you say it. But you don't really mean it do you?

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Grant Hughes

Mr Burke, your ideas about somehow having a right to make money off of someone else's footage of your team stinks of Business School and/or Marketing bullshit. You do not own the rights to images of yourself captured in public regardless of whether someone makes millions off it or not.

If you end up on a gazzillion dollar best-of or crash video you should be thankful for the FREE publicity not knocking on the production crew's door begging for royalties. If they weren't there to capture it, not only would you still get no $$ from them, but you would not have gotten any FREE exposure either.

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____________________________________________________________-

One. Class -- 2WD

www.quantumrallysport.com

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/Quantum-Rally-Sport/281129179600?ref=nf

Mark Wrote:
> correct me if i'm wrong, but aren't there already
> laws governing usage of things such as this. and
> by your logic, if rally-america air's your car in
> one of their shows, shouldn't you be entitled to a
> part of the proceeds?

No. Allowing Rally America commercial use of our likeness is one of the things we agree to when we get a license.

- Christian

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Christian Edstrom
New York, NY
Age: 30

It doesn't have to be quite that black and white. I'm assuming many teams have their 2008 schedule in place. I'm only doing 1 RA event this year, and I'm doing it to support a new regional rally and to support the work that has been done to put that together. Regional rallies in my opinion need to grow in number, and allow rally to be more local to more people.

Personally, I've been out priced from RA events in general and the series doesn't offer the same value as others. I'll be letting the organizers know that if they continue to be RA only I will not be able to attend since they do not support NASA competitors - NEFR is already off my competition schedule (...like its a really full schedule, not). In this way, the organizers can gather feedback and make decisions for next year without suffering a sudden financial loss. Any event that closes is bad for all of us.

My feeling is that competitors will vote with their wallets in the end. I am certain that there are competitors that find value in the RA program. And there are competitors that would like to move beyond 'hobby' status. I wish them the best of luck, I really do.

I also don't think all the excitement is just about the media lock-down - its a progression of mandatory 'rules' that do not fit in peoples vision of what the sport means to them. As far as I can tell, there is no road map from RA as to what they want to achieve, let alone a practical vision statement that clearly describes what that map leads to. Because of this, we look at changes and make assumptions regarding what we 'think' the new road map leads to...

So all we need is RallyRazzi's - how do the PapaRazzi's get away with publishing/selling images of people that clearly have comercial value?

Vittorio -

bjorn240 Wrote:
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> Mark Wrote:
> > correct me if i'm wrong, but aren't there
> already
> > laws governing usage of things such as this.
> and
> > by your logic, if rally-america air's your
> car in
> > one of their shows, shouldn't you be entitled
> to a
> > part of the proceeds?
>
> No. Allowing Rally America commercial use of our
> likeness is one of the things we agree to when we
> get a license.
>
> - Christian
>
> Christian Edstrom
> New York, NY
> Age: 30

nowhere on the rally-america license application does it say that by getting a license you release your rights to anything. as far as i know the same goes for when you enter the event but i didn't enter an event last year so i can't be sure.

i can't wait for travis to have to fill out the "commercial use" form for his next nitro circus video.

oh, wait, we'll never know if he does or even has to.

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-Mark
www.nocoastmotorsports.net

Josh Wimpey Wrote:
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> Mr Burke, your ideas about somehow having a right
> to make money off of someone else's footage of
> your team stinks of Business School and/or
> Marketing bullshit. You do not own the rights to
> images of yourself captured in public regardless
> of whether someone makes millions off it or not.
>

Really? So I can go to an RA event, follow block/pastrana/etc around, make my own crappy home video, put it on a DVD and sell it online?

cool.

---

Jon Burke - KI6LSW
Blog: http://psgrallywrx.blogspot.com/

Jon Burke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Really? So I can go to an RA event, follow
> block/pastrana/etc around, make my own crappy home
> video, put it on a DVD and sell it online?
>
> cool.
>


Yes, you most certainly can so long as you are on public property.

Its called "Fair use"

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____________________________________________________________-

One. Class -- 2WD

www.quantumrallysport.com

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/Quantum-Rally-Sport/281129179600?ref=nf

Lurch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> I hereby grant permission to all photographers to
> use my likeness in all press and
> communication...as long as it doesn't make me look
> silly.
>
>
>
>
Geez Lurch, quit adding to the impossible media requirements, will ya?

What you can't do is follow Block et al around and take photos and videos of them and then sell them to a company to use to sell VD treatments without the subjects consent.

But yes, you can sell video or images, of people considered to be celebrity, attained from public property (or private property with the permission of the land owner) as long as they are only used in an editorial context. Doing so would however not make you many friends...

Rally America has the right and ability to use your likeness. It doesn't not have the right or ability to license the use of your likeness for any other purpose than the promotion of Rally America.

I'd be absolutely astounded for instance if you/the team didn't have to give permission for your likeness and voice for instance to be used in DiRT.

Rally America can use your likeness to sell Rally America, that is about it.

Josh Wimpey Wrote:
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> Jon Burke Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Really? So I can go to an RA event, follow
> > block/pastrana/etc around, make my own crappy
> home
> > video, put it on a DVD and sell it online?
> >
> > cool.
> >
>
>
> Yes, you most certainly can so long as you are on
> public property.
>
> Its called "Fair use"

Erm, no. "Fair use" is the the clause in copyright law which allows things such as teachers and historical archives access to copyrighted works (without paying). It's fairly restricted, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use.

Privacy laws and "moral rights" become involved when you use someone else's likeness, particularly when they're celebrities. A person 'sort-of' owns their own reputation and "likeness", so you couldn't take a photo of Travis and use it to sell a product without his permission or use a persons image commercially.

An editorial use, say an article in a newspaper, magazine or a documentary is fine, but you can't use film clips or photos of of a person in a TV commercial or a product like a Hollywood film without their permission.

Cheers, Ted

---

Pure mathematics is the enemy of every truly creative man -- Sir Alec



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2008 09:38PM by Ted Andkilde.

Josh Wimpey Wrote:
>
> Yes, you most certainly can so long as you are on
> public property.
>
> Its called "Fair use"
>
Wow. That's not even close to right.

The basic rules are more like, "You can shoot anything you like and get it published editorially so long as it is newsworthy."

If you shoot a photo of someone and they are readily identifiable in the picture, any publishing or licensing of the work for commercial gain must be accompanied by a model release from the subject, or they would have a potential claim for damages.

In other words, picture in RallyWorld Magazine...likely ok. Picture in an advertisement for phone cards. Probably not. (Though rally drivers suing rally photographers seems pretty far-fetched, I admit.)

- Christian

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Christian Edstrom
New York, NY
Age: 30



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2008 09:43PM by bjorn240.