RWD????????

sauna rocks Wrote:
> If I had to do it all over again. I'd build an
> XR. Ugly as all heck but JV is right, they will
> perform and are great rallycars.

And as they say "Beauty is in the eye of the Beholder"
Personally I think they look cool once rallied up!

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Nick Taylor.
Knobhead.
Los Angeles, CA.

i guess your right, no e30 then..... im going to look into the xr4ti, o and is the 240 the only volvo rally platform???

o and after reading the previous post, what about a 2nd gen RX7?? (or a 88 supra???)
im just throwing ideas out there, i wanna find the right car for me. and if rwd dosnt work, then ill just fall back on the sentra

i really do appreciate the help..... hopefully ill make a decision soon...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2007 08:42PM by depape.

There have been a few decent RX7's (Andrew Havas - Gen 1, Cable Rhodes Gen 2) although interior space is at a premium, and Ralph Kosmides old car is the only Supra that I know of. I would recommend the rwd Corolla if you're thinking Toyota, although they are getting harder to find since the Drift Ricers love them.
Carl Jardevall and then Jay Streets rallied a fast 740 turbo if you want a different Volvo, although I think the slighty more compact 240 would be my choice between the two.

The Xratty is a great starter car like JVL says, as is the Volvo, but if you really DISLIKE them I would stay away. But the "upgradeability" of them is ideal.

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Nick Taylor.
Knobhead.
Los Angeles, CA.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2007 09:26PM by nick the brit.

what year Corolla do you recommend??

the xr4ti dosnt look that bad now that i look at it... how hard are they to find, and hows the aftermarket?





Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2007 10:07PM by depape.

Well Corolla's were RWD up to 87 I believe, so the 4AGE motor (1.6 twin cam) in the GTS is a nice car. Problem is, and I think it's something JVL may have said before that it is a kinda small motor amd pretty small car. That's good in the twisties, but on the faster roads it can get a bit hairy. You can get them up to about 200hp, but over that may be tricky - read expensive.
I used to rally a 76 Corolla with a 2TC 1.6 in it and it was a really fun nimble little car for a stock class rally vehicle.

The Xratty comes with a big 2300cc engine and there's no replacement for displacement. Also it has a slightly longer wheelbase so it more stable in the faster rallies. (Feel like I'm channelling John here! )
Also, you have that excellent flexibility of the XR4Ti chassis.
You can go NA RWD, Turbo RWD, or Turbo AWD - I guess you could go NA AWD but why?

Check out Grant's stuff for the Xratty in this thread - http://www.rallyanarchy.com/phorum/read.php?5,5557

He has a nice Cosworth body kit that he will be putting on there to make it look really neat.

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Nick Taylor.
Knobhead.
Los Angeles, CA.

ahhhhh i think im starting to like the xr4ti!!

are they reliable?? kinda ugly imo, but i think ill get over it. thnx


****is there anything wrong w/ rallying a 240sx****** (i need to know what the drawbacks of this are prefferably a 95'ish model)

thanks



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/2007 11:35PM by depape.

Bimmer is the best RWD rally car right now in the world.
Here's a little bit taste of what one can do:
http://www.tonigardemeister.com/salainenkansio.php
- Go and check out EK3 in-car to begin with and you'll agree - nothing comes close!
- Toni built this to have FUN. WRC cars are toooooo boring for him. He also won the rally in-cars are from by out classing the field.
- This is a MODERN car, not an old, out-dated junk you need to re-engineer everything.

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- RWD rocks -

Topi tell the OP what you think of your experiences in my Volvo rallycar.....

To the OP..... Much fun to be had in a Volvo 240.

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JohnLane

Overkill is consistently more fun

ok, seeing as this will just be a beginners rally car, and most (very very very) likely be kept in stock form and race in stock form.....

will it matter that much, as long as i get a semi capable car.

(i can always move up into a more suitable car later on)




-oh and TOPI, will an e36 325 work??

Very cool video. I have always thought Toni was a great driver, just had some bad luck and the odd silly mistake, but overall very consistent.

Depape - fill in your profile so we all know who y'are! It's the roolz!

This BMW is an awesome car but remember who's it is. Toni Gardemeister, professional rally driver so not short of cash, and also has access to some of the best car builders in the world.
Now look at 99% of the rally folks in the US - average Joe Shmoe with significant other, 2.4 sprogs, rent/mortgage and a REAL JOB. Therefore more often than not unable to farm the car build out to experts, unable to afford all the top fancy schmancy parts available etc...

What I'm saying is there really doesn't appear to be a whole host of rally specific parts available for the BMW (and those that are, are probably well pricey and not sold in this country), whereas there are quite a few bits domestically available for the other cars mentioned in this thread.
I'm not saying DON'T build the Bimmer, but it may be a tougher road.
And check out this guy here in SoCal who has a hard on for BMW - never met him but he seems to think it will be a giant-killer. I guess time will tell.

http://www.dirtye30.com/

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Nick Taylor.
Knobhead.
Los Angeles, CA.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/24/2007 11:59PM by nick the brit.

ok, im about to go fill out the ole' profile ,

and i probly wont go bmw..... ive convinced myself not to, but i keep getting little visions and dreams and want to go back to it.

ive just got to make my mind up. and for some reason i like the 240sx... and i havnt heard anything BAD about it.

I know the parts and support wont be there, but right now i just want to race in stock class until im ready to move up.

basically right now im trying to decide between rwd and fwd.... here are the choices:

-Sentra SE-R
-240sx
-merkur xr4ti ( just dont know how easy it will be to find one.... and how reliable??)

**remember, this is a starter car**

I like the 're-discovery' of RWD that is going on in US rally; great to see. It's intereting to note how the FWD config really took over US rally, starting in the 80's. A lot of light, and good, FWD cars began to emerge, and some of the Dodge Omni platforms came along with good power right out of the box and impressed everyone.

One thing that everyone found pretty quickly was that the FWD's had a distinct advantage in wet/mucky/muddy conditions. This accelerated the switchover. And, since the laws of physics are not effected by opinion, this still applies. RWD is super in dry, good traction surface conditions; FWD of the same HP level and suspension will trump in slimey, wet, slick conditions.

RWD has the advantage of being more open to serious driveline modifications and upgrades. With FWD, it's hard to do much in your own shop to swap to a totally different trannie, for example. But, this advantage is not useful for someone who is not a car fab type person. If your mechnical skills, or tools&facilites are limited, or if you are just not a gearhead, then a lot of the attractiveness of RWD cars does not apply to you.

Just some thoughts....
Mark B.

Depape (this your real name?)

You will have the most fun most quickly for the least dough if you buy a rallycar that is already a rally car.

'Stock class' will still have non-stock suspension, a roll-cage, seam welding of the shell, seatbelts to buy, a rally computer (fancy odometer), fancy seats, a need for some mechanical love, the list will go on and on.

Once you have the car you will have to have the sweatsuit, a real helmet (SA rated) and have buddies to service for ya on race day.

Building your car is cool, but do you wanna build a car or do you wanna go and thrash in the woods?

For a first car I suggest doing something that does not have big power and learn to drive it WELL. I prefer rear-drive.

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JohnLane

Overkill is consistently more fun

depape Wrote:
>
> I know the parts and support wont be there, but
> right now i just want to race in stock class until
> im ready to move up.
>

Amateur motorsports work backwards in the US. If you're on the cheap, build the car that you want and run it in whatever class it's permitted in. If you have money to burn, run Stock.

Stock class is always heavily rules restricted, and the free areas end up getting very expensive quickly.

Example: One of my friends wants to be a contender for A/Stock conesquishing this year. So, he bought a Boxster S, trailer, and several thou' worth of wheels and tires. He's doing it on the cheap, since to be competitive you need lots more tires, and since dampers are basically the only other unrestricted item,, the top guys run stuff that runs about $5k/corner just to get their feet in the door.

The more modified classes aren't as expensive, since you're allowed SO many different ways to skin your cat that there isn't one dominant car or obvious avenue in which to spend your money.

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Pete Remner
Cleveland, Ohio

1984 RX-7 (rallycross thing)
1978
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.

hey johan
names Pieter, (sounds like Peter)

i really dont mind prepping my own car. i have the helmet, seats, belts etc left over from a track car.

soooo would you consider the xr4ti over kill?????? (powerwise)

ive got it narrowed down to three, so thanks alot for the help guys!!
Im just going to look around for all three and if the right price pops up for any one... ill jump on it. (sentra, 240sx, xr4ti)

hopefully ill see you guys out on the stage in the next yr or so.
im thinking of starting with some rallyx, then taking a rally school, and then getting on the stage (how'd you guys get started??)