How would YOU "save" Rallying in N.A.?

wow this really took of and got kind of odd for a while.

the biggest "problem" for rallying in america is goegraphy. we are all too spread out.

we need to creat rally communes and clump all the competitors as close together as possible.

why does the colorado program seem to be growing so fast?

geography.

they have a VERY unique situation that is very conducive to single venuew events that can get high turnouts.

i dont think rallying is doomed. i just titled this thread the way i did to get everyones attention. and it seems to have done that.

there is only one person to blame for me not being able to afford to rally.

Me. it is my own damn fault i make as little money as i do. i am not too broken up about it either. someday i want to get behind the wheel on the stages. when that day comes my grand child might be my co driver but i will still get to do it.

good question about Colorado's rally program.

chicken or the egg?

When I was out there in January, I stopped by CheckPoint Racing and learned that the Denver area has about 50 different rally builds going on right about now.....(true? yes, no?)


so do they have a lot of events because of so many participants?


Or do they have a lot of participants because of all the events?

the CRC is new though, right? So it looks like you need members first....then build it.

---

Jon Burke - KI6LSW
Blog: http://psgrallywrx.blogspot.com/

Jon Burke Wrote:
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> good question about Colorado's rally program.
>
> chicken or the egg?

Both

>
> When I was out there in January, I stopped by
> CheckPoint Racing and learned that the Denver area
> has about 50 different rally builds going on right
> about now.....(true? yes, no?)
>
>

There aren't 50 different current builds. There are something like 50 different built or being built cars (including a handful of cars that are for sale)

> so do they have a lot of events because of so many
> participants?
>


Again, both. The hill climbs were there before there were many rally cars. But there were rally teams here in the 70s and odds are before that. In 1999 a group of people started re-building the idea of rallying in CO. It started with RallyCross for just a handful of people and then ballooned. In 2001 there was the Cog rally. In 2002 or 2003 the CHCA let rally cars run in their own class as an exhibition and the competitors have jumped at the opportunities. With there being real opportunities there is more incentive to build new cars.


> all the events?
>
> the CRC is new though, right? So it looks like
> you need members first....then build it.

The CRC is a product of the growth. Part of the goal of the CRC is to solidify that growth into a defined foundation for rally in CO. Build more competition and unite more competitors. To have something like the CRC you need low cost events, lots of people, and a desire on the behalf of the people to race. To varying degrees the idea of teh CRC has been being kicked around for over 2 years before the stars aligned and it was launched. Hopefully the frame work will now help facilitate both more growth on the competitor/supporter side and in a year or two some more events.

If Colorado can get 50 rally cars all done and running, then they will probably have around 30-35 that take the start at most events over a years time. That will be a great program. Seems like we always lose about 5 entries due to mechanical issues or something. They could have a really big 45 car field for an event also.

I'm sure there are roads available in some areas, possibly in the South West or Montana and Idaho. But if there is no rally there, no infrastructure, no organizers, no rally cars, a huge task lies ahead. Jens is really working hard to bring rally to his area, and it is very hard work. You have to have the time and will power to start it all from scratch. It's a monumental task trying to recruit and train workers where none are.

Figure what it costs to pack up PRG/ORG members from Western Washington and Oregons coast and get them over the mountains 7 to 10 hours away for a weekend to put on a rally...huge expense.

Hopefully all goes well in CRC growth and the west coast ORG/PRG/CRS can just maintain what we have. I'll bet we lose some to the travel costs and other consequences of the gas prices alone. I did notice a fair amount oof motorhomes and several bigger fishing boats heading for the coast last weekend, but there was much action at our marina..lots of slips still open.

heymagic Wrote:
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> If Colorado can get 50 rally cars all done and
> running, then they will probably have around 30-35
> that take the start at most events over a years
> time. That will be a great program. Seems like we
> always lose about 5 entries due to mechanical
> issues or something. They could have a really big
> 45 car field for an event also.
>


Kind of what we are thinking. Get consistent 25-35+ car fields then work on a second rally. Get consistent 35+ fields then a third rally (then call it quits on the expansion).

We are getting there. Right now we are an almost consistent upper teens. One, maybe two more years and we should have the competition support to look to supporting a second rally (assuming we can keep the consistent upper teens at Rally Colorado this year)


> I'm sure there are roads available in some areas,
> possibly in the South West or Montana and Idaho.
> But if there is no rally there, no infrastructure,
> no organizers, no rally cars, a huge task lies
> ahead. Jens is really working hard to bring rally
> to his area, and it is very hard work. You have to
> have the time and will power to start it all from
> scratch. It's a monumental task trying to recruit
> and train workers where none are.

starion887 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> And BTW, stage rally in the US really got active
> over 40 years ago, with the guys in MI; with
> events like POR going to a form of stage format.
> It's been here a lot longer than 20 years.
>
> BTW #2: Since lack of funds (for which I
> sympathize more than know, and to which I can
> still relate) seems to be core of your limitations
> in rally, can you come up with ome idea of what
> you CAN afford? Since the high cost of
> professionalizing the sport seems to be one of the
> thigns to drive people out, what entry fee and how
> many motel nights and so on CAN people afford to
> pay? This really needs to be answered or everyone
> chases their tails on this type of subject.
>
> Regards,
> Mark B.

Mark,

Sorry for not being able to respond to you sooner.

I reference the last 20 years because the Olympus Rallys of 1986, 87, and 88 were World Rally Championship events in Washington State. They mark the big turning point when many (most?) people in the NW Rally community felt that it might be possible for American Rally to get Professional and bigger via trickle down theory. This outlook was jointly held by many Competiors, Organizers, and Volunteers who wanted to do it again. Many still do. It remained alive within the SCCA ProRally/Divisional Rally system, saw the rise of the Spitzner era, and outlived it. Since that time the desire to "grow the sport" within a professional, sponsored, environment has been the dominant factor and goal. But I don't think trikle-down has worked out very well.

Today, for myself, it looks like this:

1. I could afford no more than 2 local events per year (like Doo Wops) when work allows.

2. I can only afford about 200 miles to an event.

3. I don't care anything about rallycross or sprints. (Not my thing.)

4. TSD as means of travelling to a one day Stage Rally might be fun.

5. Being able to camp-out and picnic is a big plus.

6. It will take me a year to rebuild & update my car to get back in the game.

7. If I wad my car up, I would have to sit-out a year before returning.

8. The Pomeroy roads of Wild West & Olympus are way too fast for my beloved Colt and me.

9. Oregon Trail was great in 1995 as an SCCA Divisional, but I wouldn't do it now.

So for me, a stable Local or Regional Stage Rally Club would still be ideal. This is what I hoped the old SCCA Divisional Rally program would provide. But then it got big ideas and crashed. Too bad. I don't think it had to be that way.

I find it curious that my financial circumstances are now probably very much like many young guys just starting out. But, I'm 61 and will probably continue working full time for at least another 10 years. I still love to play in the woods with my rally car, but could only do a Stage Rally with very limited time and resources.

Does this sound familiar to anyone else?

Rich Smith






Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/26/2008 10:56PM by Rich Smith.

Rich Smith Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I find it curious that my financial circumstances
> are now probably very much like many young guys
> just starting out. But, I'm 61 and will probably
> continue working full time for at least another 10
> years. I still love to play in the woods with my
> rally car, but could only do a Stage Rally with
> very limited time and resources.
>
> Does this sound familiar to anyone else?


Rich,

I think, it's fair to say... that at the bare minimum. you hit the nail on the head.

Cheers,

---

Andrew M
Onterrible
30ish